Grimrock

Hi Dr D,

Dr DIsaster says:
While fighting and killing the Crab is possible it takes a very long time. Some players might even give up on it thinking it's unkillable which is basically good. For some strange reason the Ogre there is - compared to the crab - rather low on life and can be killed quite easily .. twice, so he's in fact a 1500 easy XP goodie. I'd beef him to at least the same level as that crab to discourage players. BTW: when the ogre is left alive he just vanishes without a trace on dungeon completion. Therefore i'd take those 1500 XP anytime.

One more observation on the Hermitage garden: using the Arcane spells it is very VERY easy to abuse the air elementals spawned there, each being worth 400 XP. You might want to change that to discourage abuse.

Watching the Guero walkthrough, I agree that ogre is too easy to kill. No wall to stop them, door open easily, so the players don't even try to figure out what the warnings means, and the oger's specific warnings are read too late, becoming meaningless. In the same way, the powerful spells added to LG2 make all too easy. For a new release, I think that some modifications has to be made:
_ put an invisible wall in front of the oger so it can't be killed from outside and swithching off this wall as soon as the party pass through the door
_ more XP for the crab
_ some change for the elementals, but I don't know what for the moment because I don't remenber what the Arcane spell do.
_ more XP for the monsters in the dungeon itself, also too easy to kill.

Duncan1246 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:54 pm Watching the Guero walkthrough, I agree that ogre is too easy to kill. No wall to stop them, door open easily, so the players don't even try to figure out what the warnings means, and the oger's specific warnings are read too late, becoming meaningless. In the same way, the powerful spells added to LG2 make all too easy. For a new release, I think that some modifications has to be made:
_ put an invisible wall in front of the oger so it can't be killed from outside and swithching off this wall as soon as the party pass through the door
_ more XP for the crab
_ some change for the elementals, but I don't know what for the moment because I don't remenber what the Arcane spell do.
_ more XP for the monsters in the dungeon itself, also too easy to kill.

That wall idea is sound for ranged attacks from outside the area. Yet i was talking close combat. The Ogre needs to be way tougher and more dangerous.

No idea why you'd give XP for the Crab anyway. It's no threat and not ment to be killed.

About Arcane spells: Right now you can - in theory - spawn air elementals indefinitely by stepping in and out of the garden but the game slows down to a crawl after spawning like 100+ of them. Once that point is reached they are easy targets from outside using the Arcane spells. An easy solution to prevent exploiting the garden would be to simply destroy all spawned air elementals upon leaving the garden.

The monsters in the dungeon are actually fine. I wouldn't change those.

The arcane spells deal pure damage, not ethereal damage. Ethereal damage does nothing to most monsters.

Hi, Dr Disaster,
You says "No idea why you'd give XP for the Crab ", me neither... It's what? about a year since I made the last version and many corrections and changes occurs after that, so...
For the elementals, I don't see how to maintain the story as it was and accept to deal with so powerful spells. Switch the spells off, perhaps? (like a silence spell)
In the dungeon itself, the zombies are ridiculous, and the skeleton warrior is also too weak imo. See the walkthrough: no more than 10 seconds to get ride of him, it's a shame.

Duncan1246 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 10:21 pm For the elementals, I don't see how to maintain the story as it was and accept to deal with so powerful spells. Switch the spells off, perhaps? (like a silence spell)

The fix is rather simple: like i said above, once the party steps out of the garden gate all remaining air elementals get destroyed. This way you can't build a shooting gallery. To maintain the story: just move the elemental spawn point over to the path that leads to the house so the monsters do not spawn in a straight line of fire; perhaps even place blockers on the entire entrance lane. If you even want to prevent players from running past spawned elementals into the house simply place a force field there.

Duncan1246 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 10:21 pm In the dungeon itself, the zombies are ridiculous, and the skeleton warrior is also too weak imo. See the walkthrough: no more than 10 seconds to get ride of him, it's a shame.

You need to consider that Guero exploited the gardens to buff his party from level 11 to 14 or 15 before he even went into the dungeon. When I went down there with one level 10 knight it was no walk in the park.

Your solution seems right. I wait now if Thom plan to release a new version to make changes.
"You need to consider that Guero exploited the gardens to buff his party from level 11 to 14 or 15 before he even went into the dungeon. When I went down there with one level 10 knight it was no walk in the park.". Thanks for this: I feel better now

En Français - Avant de le franchir le portail de Xszark je voudrais terminer la quête. Il me manque 3 secrets, un sort, 3 ORRR3 progression : From the desert (sans doute le cube de Twisted Forest)… - Joys of the… ( ?) - Mage of… (le sort manquant). Je sais où sont les secrets mais pas comment y parvenir : 1 au NE de Village East (sans doute par l’échelle de "Abandoned Village" où j’ai essayé 2 Xszark à certains endroits), 2 le cube de Grimrock 1 pour accéder à la grande tour du SW de "Twisted Forest" – 3 au NE de "Asylum Grounds’. Pour ce qui est du cube j’ai essayé plusieurs solutions avec "Halo in Reverse" sans y parvenir. Merci d’avance et désolé pour toutes ces questions.

The same in english - Before I cross the Xszark portal I would like to complete the quest. I'm missing 3 secrets, one spell, 3 ORRR3 progression: From the desert (probably the cube of Twisted Forest)... - Joys of the... ( ?) - Mage of... (the missing spell). I know where the secrets are but not how to get there: 1 at the NE in Village East (probably by the scale of "Abandoned Village" where I tried 2 Xszark in some places), 2 the cube of Grimrock 1 to access the great tower of the SW of "Twisted Forest" - 3 to the NE of "Asylum Grounds'. As for the cube I tried several solutions with "Halo in Reverse" without succeeding. Thank you in advance and sorry for all these questions.

Comminges wrote: ↑Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:12 pm The same in english - Before I cross the Xszark portal I would like to complete the quest. I'm missing 3 secrets, one spell, 3 ORRR3 progression: From the desert (probably the cube of Twisted Forest)... - Joys of the... ( ?) - Mage of... (the missing spell). I know where the secrets are but not how to get there: 1 at the NE in Village East (probably by the scale of "Abandoned Village" where I tried 2 Xszark in some places), 2 the cube of Grimrock 1 to access the great tower of the SW of "Twisted Forest" - 3 to the NE of "Asylum Grounds'. As for the cube I tried several solutions with "Halo in Reverse" without succeeding. Thank you in advance and sorry for all these questions.

From the desert to the Forest: do the secret combination in "Halo in Reverse". There's a hint about it in the dungeon plus right here on the forums. Solving this also allows you to grab a secret.
Joys of the Old Days: give Qinea all her jewelry.
Mage of Knownledge: collect all 55 spell scrolls. Without knowing what spells you are missing it's impossible to help.

There are several secrets in NE of Village East, all tied to "Ascension".
The secret in NE of "Asylum Grounds" is accessed from another map. There is a hint about it in a room you either missed or forgot.

OK pour "From the Desert…". Pour le secret au NE de "Asylum Grounds" (vers le carreau 23-05) pourriez-vous être plus précis, j’ai pratiquement terminé et le donjon est vaste. Pour le secret de "Village East" je me suis trompé, c’est au NW (vers le carreau 06-01) et non au NE qu’il se situe. Pour le sort manquant, c’est peut-être "Time Bolt". Merci pour votre attention.

OK for "From the Desert...". For the secret to the NE of "Asylum Grounds" (towards tile 23-05) could you be more precise, I'm practically finished and the dungeon is vast. For the secret of "Village East" I was wrong, it is at the NW (towards the tile 06-01) and not the NE that it is located. For the missing spell, it may be "Time Bolt". Thank you for your attention.