Grimrock

Would making monsters or some monsters able to attack diagonally be a good idea to enhance combat and make it even harder?
It's fine the way it is now, just a random idea I was thinking about..

/thinks about the new and improved Fighter's Challenge..

Well it would completely change the strategies! I think it would also cause animation issues though, so may not be easy or ideal to implement. I think increasing monster speed is an easier option, and would have a similar effect on difficulty.

Daniel.

Oh God...

This just gave me horrible nightmares of Ultima 3...
The last game I can remember where monsters could attack you diagonally but you could only aim in the 4 cardinal directions...

But yeah Diagonal attacking wouldn't work at all in a "Grid" based game like this.

Falkentyne wrote:Oh God...

This just gave me horrible nightmares of Ultima 3...
The last game I can remember where monsters could attack you diagonally but you could only aim in the 4 cardinal directions...

But yeah Diagonal attacking wouldn't work at all in a "Grid" based game like this.

Some sort of automatic "attack of opportunity" if your opponent is the one who disengages from toe-to-toe combat would be better - or the ability to instantly turn and attack if being flanked. I've had a bit of a break from Grimrock lately but seeing if these are possible to implement through scripting is one thing drawing me to try out the editor - see if it's possible to get enemies doing the "square dance" to players already been done?

Perhaps increasing monster speed would be better. But I agree. LOG is way too easy against any single opponent if you have just 2x2 squares to dance around him. Most of the time I can defeat any opponent that way without taking a hit. For me the wasps (Shrakk Torr) are the most challengin beasts, since they are the only ones that you need to move and think really fast to defeat at lower levels, even when facing just one of them.

As the game is, my advice to dungeon designers would be to always have opponents in numbers where there are plenty of tiles to move around. Narrow corridors are more challenging. And ambushes can be challenging when you get locked in with a few monsters. But other than that, if you have enough tiles to move on, it's really no challenge at all when you can pick them out one at a time.

I would like to see the monsters re-scripted so that they could attack faster when you flank them.

Actually, it might be cool if certain monsters (like the ogre and the tentacle for example) could have 'side effects' to their attacks that come into play when dodging to the left or right.

Consider that the ogre has a wide swing attack; that attack could damage the entire party (instead of as it does now), but also damage one or two members closest to the attack, if the party switches locations after the attack has begun. In effect, damaging three tiles at once.

Believe it or not, this subject is as old as all grid-based games. While the intent of diagonal attacks may seems to be the enhancement of combat it boils down to grant monsters an advantage over player characters. Ultima 3 was mentioned here before. I recall playing the early Ultima's almost 30 years ago as my first grid-based games and those diagonal monster attacks were just this: an unfair advantage you had to adapt to.

The suggested wide swing or sweep attacks wouldn't make combat much more difficult. Instead of a simple side-step everything needed to counter such a sweep attack is to side-step plus step forward.

To really enhance combat it takes more then one form of attack per monster. For example add attacks to the left/right and even behind, i.e. by kicks for the orge, shield bashs for skeletons, pools of acid left behind by moving slime, spider webs left behind by spiders to slow player movement, a trail of fire left behind by Uggardians, tail swings/sweeps from Ice Lizards, Goromorgs making use of Darkness, Invisibility or even re-casting their shield and so on.

I was looking to grab some hints to get clues on how manage the part with blue saurian that spawn continually (level 9) and I read this thread...

If you can't dodge what's the fun, receive hits and just have enough armor/life/dodge so endure? For me it looks pointless and basic mechanism if you can't dodge. I'm curious to get the explanations.

Yeah yeah I'm slightly irritated by the game right now.

Dr.Disaster wrote:The suggested wide swing or sweep attacks wouldn't make combat much more difficult. Instead of a simple side-step everything needed to counter such a sweep attack is to side-step plus step forward.

Yeah, but if you can do that in time, then you should get away with it.

If the monsters could respond faster to players moving tiles and predict where the player will strike this would be better. Most of the monsters have to turn before they can attack player that is flanking. If the extra step of turning were removed, or sped up, the game would be more challenging. It's a little like metagaming knowing how easy it is to dodge opponents with watching witch way the monster is facing. It takes you out of the game and gives you a feeling that the AI is not all that good.

First time I played the game I defeated all the wardens without them ever getting a strike at me. It was almost tedious fighting them as they were way to clumsy to do anything.