Grimrock

Hi guys, I have a technical question about evasion and protection, and I hope some guru can answer me.

I found various armor equipments in Legend of Grimrock that gives some protection points but also a malus in terms of decreased evasion if the character does not have Light or Heavy armor proficiency.

I am trying to understand which is the break point. Better if I do an example, which of the following helms guarantee the best performance for a front fighter that does not have learn yet nor Light nor Heavy armor proficiency? For performance I mean of course less damage received.

+3 Protection
+5 Protection, -5 Evasion if you don't have Light Armor proficiency
+10 Protection, -10 Evasion if you don't have Heavy Armor proficiency

I asked the same question some days ago on a famous QA site, but I received no anwser.

a hi-dex character will rely on evasion. a physical tank will rely mostly on protection.
evasion might be better since you evade blows completely, but only thieves can raise it a lot.
fighters wear armour instead.

Specialize in one of them. High evasion or high protect is better than medicore evasion and protect.

Depends on party composition and classes.

For a classic party (2 defenders, 2 damagers), you shouldn't accept evasion penalties for the front-line characters. In fact you should be focusing them on pure defense with minimum offense making this question moot for them.
Conversely, your rear characters should be concentrating on offensive abilities and this would leave them with horrible protection/evade values, relying on positioning and front-line to keep them unhurt.
On these members, having heavy armor with penalties is not really a problem. If the enemy gets to them from side or behind, they are going to hit them anyway. Its better to have some reduction to keep them alive for 1 more blow than rely on 5% evade chance.

In fact you should be focusing them on pure defense with minimum offense making this question moot for them.

Gonna say this is a bad idea. A heavily offensive build can drop enemies before they can attack you twice. You end up taking less damage than you would have if you made half of your party harmless meatshields. If your party is taking repeated attacks from the front, the problem is not that you lack defense on your front rank, but rather that you are not fighting intelligently in the first place. Get to a 2x2 room or fight while moving backward. Open and close doors. Anything is better than standing there and letting them beat on you, and having two characters who can't contribute to the actual work of killing the enemy just means all your fights are going to take longer than they have to. In fights where you start surrounded, you need to kill enemies as quickly as possible so you aren't surrounded anymore. If your front guys have no offense, the guys in the back are going to get killed because you can't take down the flankers fast enough. Good luck getting clearing the Fighter's Challenge when the only guy who's still alive has 35 points in Armor, a spear, and no offense whatsoever.

Points in defense for the front rank (never for the back rank) are good, but suffer from diminishing returns. There's a point where you're "tough enough" and your party would be better off with weapon skills to kill the enemy faster. If you can get enough offense to kill an enemy with one attack from each party member, that's a very good breakpoint to aim for. You take a lot fewer attacks when you can drop enemies on the spot as fast as you can click.

As for whether Evasion or Protection is better, that's a tough call. I don't think any of us know exactly how the combat system works. In general it's better to stick with one type and really focus on it, but if there are diminishing returns on Evasion or Protection then a more balanced approach to defense would be better. Like I said though, we don't know how it works. I don't think there is a diminishing returns effect in place, but it's something to keep in mind when dealing with game systems that you don't know everything about. I can tell you that in this game, a character with good Evasion can be extremely hard to kill. High dexterity plus Unarmed Combat at 42+ and the Lurker set makes for a heck of a tank and can still dish out the pain. A pure defensive character with 50 ranks of Dodge would be even harder to kill, but they're also about as dangerous as a basket full of kittens (who have been declawed, defanged, and put under heavy sedation).

Empyrean wrote:Good luck getting clearing the Fighter's Challenge when the only guy who's still alive has 35 points in Armor, a spear, and no offense whatsoever.

You'd be surprised at the durability with heavy armor. You can just sit back and pound away, casually drinking health potions if your life starts to go low. Obviously some points in a weapon are also necessary but in the worst case scenario a good solid fighter will survive to carve a way out and back to the nearest blue crystal.