Grimrock

First of all I love the rune system. I don't want a "click me" spell list which would automatically cast whatever.

No, here I'm complaining about the learning way. Being "used" of DM system, I was so much loving the fact that :
- you could discover new spells by your own (I'll explain later)
- there was NO prerequisite but your own magic level (independent, and growing with your magic practice, not mob killing)

Btw I'm just beginning the game, so maybe I don't have a fine sight of what's really happening in LoG. If so, just forget my post (but say me, I'll be happy).

Being at dungeon 3rd lvl , all the spells I try to find just either :
- Fizzle (tried and slept and tried and etc. again) for spells with 1 rune only
- it says me I don't have the capacities to cast it (ok why not)

As I love magic and I want to discover them all, I putted points in every school so I could "unlock"(?) all spells, if that's the way it's working. But It's a bit a pain to have to spend points in a school to get to a certain "line" and unlock one "spell ???". Btw is this "Spell ???" a free spot for any new spell from this school I may find ? Or is it a defined spell that can't be replaced by any other ?
Actually the only 2 spell I can cast is the one I discovered BECAUSE I putted X points in fire school (the first one), and the first one from earth school. So it seems you can't just try to find new spells once you completed the "Spell ???" you had in your "magic tree".

See I'm actually a bit confuse with the magic system.
- I don't know if my number of castable spell is define by the number of spells I unlocked in my differents schools,
- I don't know if I really have to learn each school to be able to cast spells from this school or not,
- what about multischool spells ? Should I have points in fire earth ice to cast some 3+ rune based spell with those fire earth ice runes ?

Another question (damn me), what does exactly "Your spell fizzles" means ?
- this is a working combination but your level into spellcasting is too low
- this is a working combination but your level into this spell school is too low
- this is not a working combination

If you have some answer, just please don't spoil it. If the answer is a spoil itself, then just tag it as spoiler or just say me to calm down and that it will happen anytime soon to be like DM magic system

Sorry for the long post.

Fizzling means the combo does not work.
You can't unlock whatever once you skilled up to a ???, the game just doesn't want to show you what that spell is until you find the scroll.
You need a certain level in the corresponding skill to be able to cast a spell that works.
Once you cast that spell for the first time, the ??? just changes into which spell actually gets unlocked at that level.
There are no multischool spells.
It's also pretty likely that you won't get all the spells.
You can always mindlessly grind up at one of the rooms where snails or something spawn without end and unlock everything, but playing without shenanigans, you won't get that far.

gonnarule wrote: - you could discover new spells by your own (I'll explain later)

Well while you have to have the skill, you can find spells on your own, I found the light spell by myself for example, just using trial and error.

Daniel.

As far as I know:

You can only cast spells when you have enough skill points in the spells school. For instacne if you have two points in fire then you can cast the first fire spell.

You can cast a spell even if you don't have the scroll for it if you find out the right combination of runes for it.

I think if a spell fizzles then that means that the rune combination doesn't work.

If it tells you you aren't high enough in the appropriate skill to cast it then you need to put more points into a certain spell school.

So if I understand, all the "discover yourself your spells" is not working due to :

1 - you'll have to spend points in one school to unlock 1 slot for THE spell they decided you will have at this level.
2 - the time you level to this point, you'll have some chance to have found already the scroll for it
3 - once discovered / found the scroll, no reason to play with your mana, because as you don't have any "spell ???" left, you can't find anything new.

Sad about that. I just remember spending hours in DM just to figure out all combination I could try to make some spells or potions. Finding a new potion and "trying it", which could make a character poisoned or so..etc. I think (for what I've seen/read now) that DM magic system was much more fun to explore and progress into, as you were free, for real.

About the multischool spells, I'm quite sure to have found some scroll, but just can't use it right now, probably because "I don't have the good points in the good school", sad. =(

Daniel wrote: Well while you have to have the skill, you can find spells on your own, I found the light spell by myself for example, just using trial and error.
Daniel.

But did you had some "Spell ???" free spot in the corresponding school ? That's the part I'm complaining about.
It's a bit like if tanks could not at ALL use axe because they did not spent points in axe, a bit of a pity isn't it ? I would have much prefered some "free learning system", where you could find any spell by try (just having to have enough mana for it or a "general magic level") and where magic school would have bring resists, or bonus when using some kind of magic, by example :
- ice school : more dmg for ice based spells, freeze longer, etc.
- fire school : more mobs hit by a fireball, etc.

Something more open.

Let's hope for Legend of Grimrock 2.

gonnarule wrote:First of all I love the rune system. I don't want a "click me" spell list which would automatically cast whatever.

Hmm, I'd maybe even prefer "click me" spell system. In real-time combat game it would make mages more viable. Right now everywhere you look on the forums people are a bit disappointed with the usefulness of mages.

There'll be always a trade off. Not that real-time combat is bad, on the contrary, but the magic system in a real-time combat RPG will be inevitably simpler and less fun than in a turn-based combat. The best magic system was always implemented in turn-based RPGs (Wizardry VII/VIII or Final Fantasy VII come to mind).

CV77 wrote:Hmm, I'd maybe even prefer "click me" spell system.

So basically what you want is a magic assault rifle. Just pull the trigger.

I've pondered about spell systems in games quite a bit. Some of my more weird ideas can be found here: http://iki.fi/sol/magic.html

Honestly, I have ZERO clue what you guys are complaining about.

The rune system is epic, finally a game where you don't just spam your hotkey for fireball or whatever and even then the people do nothing but complaining.

The system is pretty simple and deep at the same time, if you want to cast a mighty fire spell, you have to be good in fire magic, what is not logical about that?!?
Like you said, if you later on find a battle axe, the warrior HAS to have a certain level in axe fighting to be able to use it. So needing a certain level to cast a powerful spell is absolutely
natural.

Btw. my mage is one of the most useful person in my group, once I figured the light spell I now have light even when my torches burned down, I have an ice spell that can freeze an enemy so my fighters and rogue have more time to hack and slay. It's just perfect. Sure it can get hectical to click the right runes in a fight, but exactly THAT is the point! Imagine you are down in a dungeon as a mage and are surrounded by spiders and stuff that is hitting you and you have to concentrate to cast a spell, it's not easy!

And btw, if you know there are enemies around the corner, just "prepare" the spell by selecting the right runes and THEN approach the enemy, so you have at least an easy first cast.
In addition to that, most useful spells I use currently have 2 runes... its not that hard to click 2 runes, well at least while not surrounded... THEN it gets hectical but that is exactly what I love about it!

Bottomline --> this is NOT World of Warcraft (gladly!!!!)