Grimrock

This one is Waaay out there, but contemplate if it existed...

LoG2 will (we all assume as a given) will ship with an integrated dungeon editor (or one will soon follow in a subsequent patch); So what ~might~ be really cool [million style points IMO], would be if the Grimrock 2 editor shipped with a 'best effort' one-click LoG1 conversion prep feature... Not necessarily something that will outright convert any LoG1 map to LoG2 format, but functionality that will give an old project a once through (or twice through), and convert the straightforward parts to LoG2 (things like core map layout, and placement of like objects), and perhaps 'auto comment' (out?) any scripts with unclear or problematic functions; This could be blanket assumption or actually have a little bit of heuristic behavior involved (but I'm assuming not).

The end result being a stripped framework of an LoG1 mod blocked out in LoG2 format with commented ToDo notes in any script that warrants it. This could cause a rewrite of something trivial, or be more along the lines of this...

--~={ToDo:}=================================================================
--~ This function uses depreciated calls to a feature that is no longer present or needed.
--~ Please see the updated scripting documentation for information about the new function usage.
--~ bogusURL.grimrock.net/forum/posting.php?mode=reply&f=18&t=5159

--~function setChamp(champion, state)
--~ party:getChampion(champion):setEnable(state)
--~end
--~========================================================================

*** The reason I want this and think that others might also, is that LoG1 forced many compromises and jumping through hoops to realize one's ideas ~and was great! But I think that anyone that was of a mind to create an involved project will probably want to convert it to LoG2 format; not the least reason of which is to take advantage of the new features ~which in some cases might allow things they could not manage originally ~but could if they do the conversion. So yeah, I'd love it if the LoG2 had rudimentary support for importing LoG1 editor projects ~~even if they finish importing in a broken state... getting even 40% of a project imported at the start would be fantastic IMO.

I know that the only really compelling reason to include this, would be if it could convert it perfectly and allow end users to use LoG1 mods in Log2 ~and that won't be happening, but for myself, even the least help with mod conversion for mod authors would be a great boon and a well appreciated time saver for all that plan to port their mods over to LoG2.

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New Post:

I had an interesting Idea (I thought): Imagine if the LoG2 editor allowed you to 'tint' cells on the map to a chosen color; this would not show up in the game, but have it that the
monster AI can be restricted to traversing only permitted color tiles. One example of application for this is to have one monster that cannot leave a room ~for whatever reason, while allowing any other monsters free access to the map, including that room. They could leave by the door, but the restricted one could not. In practice, the restricted monster could appear to be too big for the door, but smaller monsters in the room would pass through the door easily. AFAIK tho only way currently to attempt this is with blockers ~and they block the path for all monsters. The color could be the condition, and there could be many many user defined zones this way.

**Another application for this would be to aid the the AI in custom terrain.

*** How about this... what if the AI could traverse more than one color, but the colors were prioritized? (For example... The AI tends to stick to the path, but could cross the damage-tile if need be.)

Hi, I'm new here but I've been playing the game for about a week amd I'm loving it. It reminds me of being 12 again.

I wanyed to contribute something to your discussion in hopes that the developers might actually impliment this.

There are so few rpg games other there with simple co-op multiplayer (MMORPGs being an exception). All these games have their roots in pen and paper RPGs like AD&D. But playing a PnP game is about people sitting together in a room. It's a group activity.

If this game were to have a beefed up construction kit and the possibillity of up to 4 player co-op. It would mayne apeal to some PnP enthusiasts.

I'm no game designer or programmer, but to me it seems simple to impliment even with the current game. Obviously there would need to be a game lobby etc. Which is a whole different story. But ingame, you could just remove the clipping from the characters so that all 4 could stand in 1 spot. And have an interface for swapping positions between the 4 slots. Then characters could wander off by themselves without being blocked by another player. Steam already has a native mic system in place for multiplayer.

The automap could be recorded on individual computers and not update until the players meet up (occupy the same square)

TSotP wrote:Hi, I'm new here but I've been playing the game for about a week amd I'm loving it. It reminds me of being 12 again.

I wanyed to contribute something to your discussion in hopes that the developers might actually impliment this.

There are so few rpg games other there with simple co-op multiplayer (MMORPGs being an exception). All these games have their roots in pen and paper RPGs like AD&D. But playing a PnP game is about people sitting together in a room. It's a group activity.

If this game were to have a beefed up construction kit and the possibillity of up to 4 player co-op. It would mayne apeal to some PnP enthusiasts.

I'm no game designer or programmer, but to me it seems simple to impliment even with the current game. Obviously there would need to be a game lobby etc. Which is a whole different story. But ingame, you could just remove the clipping from the characters so that all 4 could stand in 1 spot. And have an interface for swapping positions between the 4 slots. Then characters could wander off by themselves without being blocked by another player. Steam already has a native mic system in place for multiplayer.

The automap could be recorded on individual computers and not update until the players meet up (occupy the same square)

There has been much discussion of multiplayer. One problem here is how would you graphically represent different players? It would be enormous work to show them, but shiny balls, etc would not really fit well.

Of course that's just what I always bring up. Most other people mention that it woulld distract from the main game i.e single player. (Also true)

... That and most [if not all] of the game, and all mods, assume a single indivisible party... Changing this could break puzzles and render a map trivial to complete.

Or for instance... In our ORRR2 mod, we have lots of [consecutive] scripted party events and aspects of the rooms get erased when the party isn't near them; but with two (or more) party's roaming the halls, that could ruin the benefits of it; or make it a nightmare to test.

* Even in the upcoming LoG2 though... Multiplayer cannot just be tacked on; it's much more than just adding 2nd player camera and an animated party.

TSotP wrote:I wanyed to contribute something to your discussion in hopes that the developers might actually impliment this.

There are so few rpg games other there with simple co-op multiplayer (MMORPGs being an exception). All these games have their roots in pen and paper RPGs like AD&D. But playing a PnP game is about people sitting together in a room. It's a group activity.

If this game were to have a beefed up construction kit and the possibillity of up to 4 player co-op. It would mayne apeal to some PnP enthusiasts.

Suggestions are welcome but towards the topic of multiplayer AH already made their point:

petri wrote:I can confirm that LOG2 will be pure single player goodness, there will be no multiplayer mode. MP just doesn't fit into the game we have in mind.

viewtopic.php?f=18&t=5159&start=30#p62046

Temporary "Old Fart Modus".

At two or three occasions in the original game I had to get my 16yr old son to help me out with the challenges, because my reflexes were not fast enough anymore. I gave up after 100 tries or so, he came in and did it in one or two.

Maybe there can be a spell that slows the game down for a short period (basically increase the reaction time of the characters). Make the duration of the spell and the amount of slow down dependent on the level of the spell caster.

--
Lyon

Thanks for the info guys. I knew it wouldn't be as simple as I made out. And a little (but only a little lol) disappointing.

I can see it not fitting with their vision of the game.

But as for graphically representing them in game. Generic male and female head models of the availible races. With 3 basic animations: casting/throwing, slashing/bashing/chopping and a bow shooting animation.. The weapons equipped would be determined by the class of the character and what they were equipped with, but not the actual equipment they have.

Just give the characters generic body/armor models in 1 of 4 colours. Robes for mages, light armor fornrogues and heavy armor for warriors. A generic axe, sword, mace, shield, dagger(s), torch and staff depending on what was currently equipped.

TSotP wrote:But as for graphically representing them in game. Generic male and female head models of the availible races. With 3 basic animations: casting/throwing, slashing/bashing/chopping and a bow shooting animation.. The weapons equipped would be determined by the class of the character and what they were equipped with, but not the actual equipment they have.

Just give the characters generic body/armor models in 1 of 4 colours. Robes for mages, light armor fornrogues and heavy armor for warriors. A generic axe, sword, mace, shield, dagger(s), torch and staff depending on what was currently equipped.

Haha. You just described in couple of sentences at minimum of 3 months of work with just the graphics, let alone the coding stuff. To get the variation in bodytypes, faces and equipment we'd want to have, you'd have to multiply that work amount by 5x to get even close. That's pretty much out of our reach. Sorry.

juho wrote:

TSotP wrote:But as for graphically representing them in game. Generic male and female head models of the availible races. With 3 basic animations: casting/throwing, slashing/bashing/chopping and a bow shooting animation.. The weapons equipped would be determined by the class of the character and what they were equipped with, but not the actual equipment they have.

Just give the characters generic body/armor models in 1 of 4 colours. Robes for mages, light armor fornrogues and heavy armor for warriors. A generic axe, sword, mace, shield, dagger(s), torch and staff depending on what was currently equipped.

Haha. You just described in couple of sentences at minimum of 3 months of work with just the graphics, let alone the coding stuff. To get the variation in bodytypes, faces and equipment we'd want to have, you'd have to multiply that work amount by 5x to get even close. That's pretty much out of our reach. Sorry.

That's cool dude, thanks for responding. Someone already directed me to a post stating that Multiplayer wasn't an option. As you can tell, i have no actual experience in this regard. I was just really throwing out ideas.

But for the sake of conversation, Could the game models already in place for the weapons on the ground not be converted for character use? Also, could Tintmaps not be used to apply colour to the characters based on player number?

TSotP wrote:But for the sake of conversation, Could the game models already in place for the weapons on the ground not be converted for character use?

I've done it; armor too. It's possible. (And it does speed things up quite a bit.)