Grimrock

Off topic but I'm actually a fan of 4th ed D&D! New campaign starting tonight in fact.

Daniel.

Darklord wrote:

Drax wrote:Having to view a guide to clarify details of stats isn't good.

Well there is a lot of detail in game, anything that isn't you don't really need to know. I do understand that many of us do like extra detail though.

Daniel.

I don't think the effect of your stats on character progression is 'extra detail'. Particulary when your essentially locked into one levelling route per play through.

E: 'you don't really need to know' is pretty condescending.

Drax wrote: I don't think the effect of your stats on character progression is 'extra detail'. Particulary when your essentially locked into one levelling route per play through.

E: 'you don't really need to know' is pretty condescending.

And you are of course perfectly entitled to that view, others (including myself) are happy to read about it elsewhere. I was to busy enjoying the game to worry about it!

I don't personally feel that every player needs to know every single detail right up front. But like I said I do understand that some players do like that detail. Few games include every single detail built right in, and those that do may not be made by a small team.

I think the AH guys have done a great job myself, perfect or not.

Daniel.

I think it's great, but I'd love to see more details exposed during character creation and levelling up.

I'm saying it as an aspect of game design. When you force your users to go out of the game for details, your detracting from your own game. They're spending time on a website, not playing. It's the reason a lot of games offer beginner and advanced tooltips and helps. Users of different calibres can interact with the information in a way they feel comfortable.

I don't understand the reasoning for deliberately hiding information from the user about their own stats. The game does really well at teaching you about traps and secrets and that but not so much about yourself. There's an aspect of theorycrafting, true. But the lack of skill points means each one becomes precious.

about this point I must say as LoG is a game even more player skills oriented than their oldie counterparts, the control of details like in other RPG games is slightly less important to me, I mean, more "invisible", or more smooth. I do not have the need to know every detail of internal mechanics.

Of course it has its importance but, to me, not dramatically.

Greetings

I worry about a lot of the balance implications of the skill system.

While the current system is passable, it makes it quite easy to mess up your character. the defensive skills are OK, but generally not worth it because to defeat stronger enemies you still need to resort to circle strafing and kiting.

The problem I foresee going forward is this: a character's power is at its high point when the character hits ~ level 13 because they can have 50 in their given attack skill, and that's pretty much the current "best" way to play.

This becomes a problem because, going forward in future dungeons enemies either need to give a ton more experience but not have much more health, or there needs to be additional levels added to the skills. Neither solution seems that elegant, though. The problem is, as a rogue, after you max say, throwing weapons, what next? Maybe some dodge but who cares, it's back row anyway. There's nothing that can further improve the rogue's damage, and not much for utility.

I love the game, but I think some of the aspects of balance weren't fully developed, which is fine. It's part of the game's charm, but it presents a sort of challenge for them to correct going forward, and hopefully they take that into account.

Hachi wrote:I worry about a lot of the balance implications of the skill system.

While the current system is passable, it makes it quite easy to mess up your character. the defensive skills are OK, but generally not worth it because to defeat stronger enemies you still need to resort to circle strafing and kiting.

The problem I foresee going forward is this: a character's power is at its high point when the character hits ~ level 13 because they can have 50 in their given attack skill, and that's pretty much the current "best" way to play.

This becomes a problem because, going forward in future dungeons enemies either need to give a ton more experience but not have much more health, or there needs to be additional levels added to the skills. Neither solution seems that elegant, though. The problem is, as a rogue, after you max say, throwing weapons, what next? Maybe some dodge but who cares, it's back row anyway. There's nothing that can further improve the rogue's damage, and not much for utility.

I love the game, but I think some of the aspects of balance weren't fully developed, which is fine. It's part of the game's charm, but it presents a sort of challenge for them to correct going forward, and hopefully they take that into account.

I am completely sure there is space for improvements, if it is as you say, future dungeons with the same party could turn the game in a simply hack fest without real rpg improvement of the characters.

As I say I do not pay extreme attention to that details in this game, and I am lacking info, but if it is true it could be a point to take in account by the devs.

Greetings.

I solved it by making a party that has all 16's in stats and all 50's in skills Ofcourse that makes combat trivial but I really don't play games like this for combat... (not that Im bad at it, I can "dance' pretty well, have quick reactions and probably can kill most stuff in the game with rocks if needed ) .. it's just I play games like this for the exploration, puzzles and finding secrets

DJK wrote:I solved it by making a party that has all 16's in stats and all 50's in skills Ofcourse that makes combat trivial but I really don't play games like this for combat... (not that Im bad at it, I can "dance' pretty well, have quick reactions and probably can kill most stuff in the game with rocks if needed ) .. it's just I play games like this for the exploration, puzzles and finding secrets

How exactly would you dance around a room full of spiders and throw a rock? Or even later on in the game eventually theres room were you just can't dance and by throwing a rock it makes it almost impossible to go get it.