Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 11:01 pm
Sir, you deserve a medalTΛPETRVE wrote:Time to hone my translation skills, I guess.
....
Grimrock
Official Legend of Grimrock Forums
http://grimrock.net/forum/
Grimrock links - ARTICLES and REVIEWS
Page 6 of 9
Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 1:38 am
Ok, now i'm really sorry to all grammar nazis out there, but i tried to make use of my CAE skills and made a little translation of Czech review (http://games.tiscali.cz/recenze/legend- ... enze-59083)
Feel free to correct me!
Verdict: Hell of a good cellar adventure that might revive the othervise dormant genre. Legend of Grimrock proves that the newly painted iron does not age as well as it might seem. A scope could be wider and the combat system could be more complex , but the first-class quality of dungeon design is (literally) beating any deficiencies to death.
Dungeon crawler, step dungeon - it's a paradise for lovers of grid paper, who are refusing to recognize terms such as continuum and continuity. Paradise, where the only law the of the basement are right angles. If the (point-and-click) adventure genre complains about about sitting in a little remote corner of darkness, dungeons were staring staring into the deep abyss at the end of the world for several years. This depth is sometimes visited by only the bravest. But this is about to change now.
(I skipped next 2 sentences, since they don't make sence even in the czech
- but shortly: game looks really good 
)
Love on the nineteenth sight
The principle of the Grimrock is very simple. You are thrown into a world without natural light. Forward, backward, left, right, and then turn left by 90 degrees (or by your right pawn). Drop item, pick it, throw it into the distance. Open the doors by unlocking them, or by using the correct switch. Or by solving a devious puzzle. Monster are targets of bashing, shooting, throwing or casting. Indeed, a simple list of rules.
To be honest, I had never come into contact with this genre before. And just as Elvis is "fat and dead", I considered dungeons to be obsolete. Once the authors reported the project some time ago, I wondered and decided that if I'm going to partake a trip into history, I should at least wear a coat that will please my bastarded eyes.
At first I had the impression that reviewing the dungeon with it's classic minimalist rules is similiar to evaluation of gomoku in 3D, and I had this feeling for few hours. I had to fight the controls for a few hours. Altought simple, they are still unusual, so that before they get into your blood, levels will flow just as the water does in a well-fed mountain stream. Fortunately, the creators anticipated this, so the initial two or three floors are relatively easy. At about this moment you will either be charmed by Grimrock, or you will return to the warmth and comfort of the land ruled by already well-established favorites, whatever they may be.
There is oldschool and oldschool
I believe it is important to emphasize that the game fails to highlight some important rules of the game. I know - It used to be normal that one had to read the manual before even starting to play the game, but ... After all, the gaming industry has moved forward (at least in some ways) and learned that people do not read manuals, they want thinks to be intuitive and would like to know in advance what are the optimal choices. Not without reason.
One is frustrated when a small misunderstanding of sloppily explained element or a bad choice ruins the game ten hours later (unwittingly I remember several restarts of Morrowind, Fallout and Baldur's Gate). The creators of LoG realized this and so we have pop-up tooltips, a very functional controls, optional predefined party and auto-collect of ammunition. But still, there are vague hints, which, although leading to a goal, are not quite clear and entirely understandable.
Sorry, what did you say?
To be concrete: you will find a blue crystal in the game very early. Next to it lies a scroll, which states that if you touch the crystal, it restores your energy, and dead comrades will return back to life. I almost snapped a balloon under me when I saw this and I began to worry that a game will be too accessible and will continue to be primitive - keys lying next to doors, or secret buttons adjacent to doors (do not worry, this is not true!).
Clicking on the crystal is a matter of moment and its effect can be immediately observed, therefore I consider it unnecessary to explain such a thing in-game.On the other hand, what the game will not explain directly, but rather in complicated fashion (I did not notice it, my colleagues did), are food related problems. About 8th level (12 hours of play), I found that when a character is really starving, it won't die. But it's does not renew health and energy.
How come i found out about this so late in the game? Firstly, food started to run out at about this level. And secondly, it takes about 15 minutes to character to start to feel starvation. And then, it takes about 5 minutes until maximal starvation kicks in. So, after about 60% of the game I had to completely remake the strategy of fights and resource management (because magicians can not cast spells without energy). There is a few of faux-pas like this in the game. With all its focus Grimrock tends to the fact, that the vast majority of players will play it only once. It is therefore advisable that all mechanics of the game are understood by the players before the starting of the game or during the first minutes. And be it oldschool or not, i could not find info about my problem with food in the manual.
This oldschool way is grasped by the wrong end. Since, in addition to its crudeness, it offers (in my opinion unnecessary) option to disable the automapping. I'm deep down convinced that the witnesses (i.e. old players) are not attracted to oldschool because of different package, and certainly not because they would like to cut themselves and breathe tear gas while being tormented by roar of the sirens in the process of unpacking that different package. They are attracted by the different content which is no more made - and in this respect, the Legend of Grimrock absolutely reigns (ok, ok, it rules).
Cellar prima ballerina ...
The focus of gameplay is the holy trinity: exploration, combat and puzzles. The story is beautifully crazy, but it plays second fiddle most of the time. It gets to its word in the final part of the game. Music is completely missing, which is a shame because the song in the menu is nice. The exploration is hellishly demanding to spatial orientation and memory, just like is the art of proper usage of markings in the map. Indeed, you can spend whole lazy afternoon to just looking into it.
Grimrock helps it's puzzles with teleporters, pits to otherwise inaccessible parts of the lower floors, hidden switches and other delightful thinks, and it must be said that the dungeon master really did a good job. Thankfully, he kept himself at bay at did not put in parade of mindfucks, solvable by using 4th grade differential equations.
The game, despite it's challenging spatial puzzles, plays unexpectedly well and often, you won't even realize that you have just entered the stage of wandering and searching. I was really caught by usage of pits. I discovered its charm later in the game - this was obviously planned by the authors. I was amused when I jumped into one of the pit only to find pleasantly sarcastic note "here as nothing is to be found".
... in cheap boots
Fights are, for reasons unknown to me, described as tactical. In general, tactics has several levels, but unfortunately in LoG, it is limited to anemic clicking on the weapons, casting spells, throwing items and effective reversing or running in a square - around the pole or hole. I thought that I finally know where the first shooters took in the famous sidestep-while-aiming-with-mouse-and-constantly-firing tactics. But as this video excursion into history has shown, dungeons did not utilize such tactics.
Running around is a necessity, since it is common that your group (i.e. it's members) can withstand three or four hits, while the monster twenty or more. If you are attacked from more than one side, and you have nowhere to run, do not hesitate and just load the save. It really bothers me that Grimrock (like many old games) literally forces it's players to look for holes deliberately designed in the pattern of usage of various tricks for luring monsters one by one, running up the stairs and back, returning repeatedly to the miraculous crystals over a half floors, etc..
In comparison to old dungeons, based on a static molding in statistics, there is a noticeable shift, but I could imagine significant improvements - for example, the usage of traps would change the figths beyond recognition. Rune magic system is asking for utilization in fashion similar to Magicka games. But here it is criminally underutilized, as there is about only 10 usable spells. Theoretically, there is 512 combinations, so the result is really poor. On the other hand, game is designed for usage of such limited number of spells, so i cannot really say it's upright wrong. Although quick-slots and hot keys would not hurt.
Hopeful view at the horizon
In the text, maybe it looks negative, but the truth is that the fights, in the way they are designed, are functional, despite all the comments. And they work well, but all that untapped potential is evident. The pity of it is greater, when one comes into realization of the amount of time spent in the combats. The five minute long cutting of sixth dwarven dinosaur in a row, of course coupled with a "frantic circulation in the ring" dependent on error-free control of the party motion - it really can ruin the experience.
But there is no point on lamenting over something that game does not offer, while all the thinks that should work work well, and while the ambitions of the game probably lies beyond my imagination. It is very nice that the game as a whole lacks the uselessness and is made with an unusual elegance (besides the combat part). So let's go ahead into the mountain and.. save often.
Damn i hope the man who wrote that review won't find my address
Feel free to correct me!
Verdict: Hell of a good cellar adventure that might revive the othervise dormant genre. Legend of Grimrock proves that the newly painted iron does not age as well as it might seem. A scope could be wider and the combat system could be more complex , but the first-class quality of dungeon design is (literally) beating any deficiencies to death.
Dungeon crawler, step dungeon - it's a paradise for lovers of grid paper, who are refusing to recognize terms such as continuum and continuity. Paradise, where the only law the of the basement are right angles. If the (point-and-click) adventure genre complains about about sitting in a little remote corner of darkness, dungeons were staring staring into the deep abyss at the end of the world for several years. This depth is sometimes visited by only the bravest. But this is about to change now.
(I skipped next 2 sentences, since they don't make sence even in the czech
- but shortly: game looks really good )Love on the nineteenth sight
The principle of the Grimrock is very simple. You are thrown into a world without natural light. Forward, backward, left, right, and then turn left by 90 degrees (or by your right pawn). Drop item, pick it, throw it into the distance. Open the doors by unlocking them, or by using the correct switch. Or by solving a devious puzzle. Monster are targets of bashing, shooting, throwing or casting. Indeed, a simple list of rules.
To be honest, I had never come into contact with this genre before. And just as Elvis is "fat and dead", I considered dungeons to be obsolete. Once the authors reported the project some time ago, I wondered and decided that if I'm going to partake a trip into history, I should at least wear a coat that will please my bastarded eyes.
At first I had the impression that reviewing the dungeon with it's classic minimalist rules is similiar to evaluation of gomoku in 3D, and I had this feeling for few hours. I had to fight the controls for a few hours. Altought simple, they are still unusual, so that before they get into your blood, levels will flow just as the water does in a well-fed mountain stream. Fortunately, the creators anticipated this, so the initial two or three floors are relatively easy. At about this moment you will either be charmed by Grimrock, or you will return to the warmth and comfort of the land ruled by already well-established favorites, whatever they may be.
There is oldschool and oldschool
I believe it is important to emphasize that the game fails to highlight some important rules of the game. I know - It used to be normal that one had to read the manual before even starting to play the game, but ... After all, the gaming industry has moved forward (at least in some ways) and learned that people do not read manuals, they want thinks to be intuitive and would like to know in advance what are the optimal choices. Not without reason.
One is frustrated when a small misunderstanding of sloppily explained element or a bad choice ruins the game ten hours later (unwittingly I remember several restarts of Morrowind, Fallout and Baldur's Gate). The creators of LoG realized this and so we have pop-up tooltips, a very functional controls, optional predefined party and auto-collect of ammunition. But still, there are vague hints, which, although leading to a goal, are not quite clear and entirely understandable.
Sorry, what did you say?
To be concrete: you will find a blue crystal in the game very early. Next to it lies a scroll, which states that if you touch the crystal, it restores your energy, and dead comrades will return back to life. I almost snapped a balloon under me when I saw this and I began to worry that a game will be too accessible and will continue to be primitive - keys lying next to doors, or secret buttons adjacent to doors (do not worry, this is not true!).
Clicking on the crystal is a matter of moment and its effect can be immediately observed, therefore I consider it unnecessary to explain such a thing in-game.On the other hand, what the game will not explain directly, but rather in complicated fashion (I did not notice it, my colleagues did), are food related problems. About 8th level (12 hours of play), I found that when a character is really starving, it won't die. But it's does not renew health and energy.
How come i found out about this so late in the game? Firstly, food started to run out at about this level. And secondly, it takes about 15 minutes to character to start to feel starvation. And then, it takes about 5 minutes until maximal starvation kicks in. So, after about 60% of the game I had to completely remake the strategy of fights and resource management (because magicians can not cast spells without energy). There is a few of faux-pas like this in the game. With all its focus Grimrock tends to the fact, that the vast majority of players will play it only once. It is therefore advisable that all mechanics of the game are understood by the players before the starting of the game or during the first minutes. And be it oldschool or not, i could not find info about my problem with food in the manual.
This oldschool way is grasped by the wrong end. Since, in addition to its crudeness, it offers (in my opinion unnecessary) option to disable the automapping. I'm deep down convinced that the witnesses (i.e. old players) are not attracted to oldschool because of different package, and certainly not because they would like to cut themselves and breathe tear gas while being tormented by roar of the sirens in the process of unpacking that different package. They are attracted by the different content which is no more made - and in this respect, the Legend of Grimrock absolutely reigns (ok, ok, it rules
).Cellar prima ballerina ...
The focus of gameplay is the holy trinity: exploration, combat and puzzles. The story is beautifully crazy, but it plays second fiddle most of the time. It gets to its word in the final part of the game. Music is completely missing, which is a shame because the song in the menu is nice. The exploration is hellishly demanding to spatial orientation and memory, just like is the art of proper usage of markings in the map. Indeed, you can spend whole lazy afternoon to just looking into it.
Grimrock helps it's puzzles with teleporters, pits to otherwise inaccessible parts of the lower floors, hidden switches and other delightful thinks, and it must be said that the dungeon master really did a good job. Thankfully, he kept himself at bay at did not put in parade of mindfucks, solvable by using 4th grade differential equations.
The game, despite it's challenging spatial puzzles, plays unexpectedly well and often, you won't even realize that you have just entered the stage of wandering and searching. I was really caught by usage of pits. I discovered its charm later in the game - this was obviously planned by the authors. I was amused when I jumped into one of the pit only to find pleasantly sarcastic note "here as nothing is to be found".
... in cheap boots
Fights are, for reasons unknown to me, described as tactical. In general, tactics has several levels, but unfortunately in LoG, it is limited to anemic clicking on the weapons, casting spells, throwing items and effective reversing or running in a square - around the pole or hole. I thought that I finally know where the first shooters took in the famous sidestep-while-aiming-with-mouse-and-constantly-firing tactics. But as this video excursion into history has shown, dungeons did not utilize such tactics.
Running around is a necessity, since it is common that your group (i.e. it's members) can withstand three or four hits, while the monster twenty or more. If you are attacked from more than one side, and you have nowhere to run, do not hesitate and just load the save. It really bothers me that Grimrock (like many old games) literally forces it's players to look for holes deliberately designed in the pattern of usage of various tricks for luring monsters one by one, running up the stairs and back, returning repeatedly to the miraculous crystals over a half floors, etc..
In comparison to old dungeons, based on a static molding in statistics, there is a noticeable shift, but I could imagine significant improvements - for example, the usage of traps would change the figths beyond recognition. Rune magic system is asking for utilization in fashion similar to Magicka games. But here it is criminally underutilized, as there is about only 10 usable spells. Theoretically, there is 512 combinations, so the result is really poor. On the other hand, game is designed for usage of such limited number of spells, so i cannot really say it's upright wrong. Although quick-slots and hot keys would not hurt.
Hopeful view at the horizon
In the text, maybe it looks negative, but the truth is that the fights, in the way they are designed, are functional, despite all the comments. And they work well, but all that untapped potential is evident. The pity of it is greater, when one comes into realization of the amount of time spent in the combats. The five minute long cutting of sixth dwarven dinosaur in a row, of course coupled with a "frantic circulation in the ring" dependent on error-free control of the party motion - it really can ruin the experience.
But there is no point on lamenting over something that game does not offer, while all the thinks that should work work well, and while the ambitions of the game probably lies beyond my imagination. It is very nice that the game as a whole lacks the uselessness and is made with an unusual elegance (besides the combat part). So let's go ahead into the mountain and.. save often.
Damn i hope the man who wrote that review won't find my address
Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:55 am
Thanks guys!
That Eurogamer review espcially was awesome, best review I've read so far.
Daniel.
That Eurogamer review espcially was awesome, best review I've read so far.
Daniel.
Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 12:59 pm
Well, it's perfectly legible, although some literal translation of idioms results in hilarityFilipsan wrote:Damn i hope the man who wrote that review won't find my address
.Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:00 pm
Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:09 pm
telgor wrote:Oh God. I can't take this anymore!Crashbanito wrote:Nice Release Trailer!
*Jumps out window
I'd attempt to save you, but I'm driving right now and that just doesn't sound safe.
Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:16 pm
Nice! One last treat before release.Crashbanito wrote:Nice Release Trailer!
Less than two hours now!Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:22 am
Re: Grimrock links
Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:39 pm
German Let's Play of LoG (mine =P)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... e=view_all
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... e=view_all