Grimrock

Saice wrote:I was able to get through my whole party in under a second. With this most of the time I could attack with my full party and then step away and not get hit.

I did a similar thing, but with 3 melee and when I stepped back I had the ranged casting of the mage to attack with at a distance. It's really not that different except that you have more to click for the mage, but all the down time between swings to do it in.

Then yes, if you find the clicking tedious or difficult, I can see that being a good reason not to do it. It was certainly effective given that you can do the clicking, so I don't know if it's fair to say that the mage is lacking. More like it's just not of a style you enjoy.

Saice wrote:My new play through is solo Toorum and I'm going full on fire mage with him for the challenge of it.

Don't! Well, I'm probably not going to stop you so good luck is all I can say . I found it too tedious to continue past level 6.

While mages can be on the weak side, especially the earth and fire branches. It is very much overlooked that a spell can never 'miss' if it connects(poor aim with bolts notwithstanding). From what I can tell the spell also hits every monster in a stack. 3 good sparks/fires/iceshards will kill a group of 4 skeletons without issue. Of course there is the issue in this case of denying the rest of the party experience but in all of my hard runs it never caused me any grief.

Sadly there are few times in the game where the mage's other utilities become worthwhile, only for earth, fire, and air. I am speaking of course of the protection spells. Spiders and those lightning belching hellbats should have appeared in groups more frequently later in the dungeon. This would have made the mage a far more handy companion who actually acts as a shield for the group.

Chiller wrote:You are assuming something which isn't true, namely that you need skills to actually use armor. The game has no such restrictions. My back row guys, be they mages or rogues, pretty much end up clad in very heavy armor.

Your choice of weapons is more limited as they do have some requirements. If you want to attack efficiently the only class that's actually restricted is the Fighter (you can only have 2 of them because they can only use front row weapons).

putting Light or Heavy Armor on someone who isn't skilled enough to wear it without penalties is like removing the wheels from a bicycle to make it go faster by making it lighter... likewise, claiming Fighters are limited because they don't have Reach is like saying birds are limited because they're poor at walking around on the ground.

Kailos wrote:It is very much overlooked that a spell can never 'miss' if it doesn't miss.

there, i fixed that for you.

On normal, hard, and on my speedrun, I used an ice mage and felt him to be basically the most important character in the group.

I finished the game with 4 mages on normal. It was fun.

pongsifu wrote:On normal, hard, and on my speedrun, I used an ice mage and felt him to be basically the most important character in the group.

1. You either rested your ass sore, or quaffed energy potions non stop or both.
2. You kept bashing with a spear or threw stuff with your Mage once energy was low.

The first one is tedious, and the second one makes Rogue a much better choice.

I actually like Mage, there is nothing wrong with their damage if trained right. My real problem is that even if I like the Mage, he won't be missed at all if not there. An extra Rogue will give you less burst, but more sustained damage, and I never really needed the extreme burst a Mage can offer anyway.

Sabatasso wrote:

pongsifu wrote:On normal, hard, and on my speedrun, I used an ice mage and felt him to be basically the most important character in the group.

1. You either rested your ass sore, or quaffed energy potions non stop or both.
2. You kept bashing with a spear or threw stuff with your Mage once energy was low.

The first one is tedious, and the second one makes Rogue a much better choice.

I actually like Mage, there is nothing wrong with their damage if trained right. My real problem is that even if I like the Mage, he won't be missed at all if not there. An extra Rogue will give you less burst, but more sustained damage, and I never really needed the extreme burst a Mage can offer anyway.

Believe it or not I never made a single energy pot on either my normal or hard playthrough. I did make several on my speedrun though. I only rested 3-4 times throughout because I thought it makes you hungry (I always ended up with a ton of extra food anyway, even on my speedrun) and the resting was only for healing, not for energy. As for throwing things or a pike, my mage did absolutely nothing but cast spells. I had a missile rogue, so she took care of throwing early on and used missile weapons once I found them.

Basically I didn't cast spells for every single encounter. I conserved for enemies I thought would need it. Casting for every mob would of course make you run out very quick.

NakedGranny wrote:

Chiller wrote:

Kailos wrote:It is very much overlooked that a spell can never 'miss' if it doesn't miss.

there, i fixed that for you.

Again, only in the case of the bolt based spells.

You still will not get a 'miss' like you do when attacking in melee where you do not even get a damage indicator.

Kailos wrote: Again, only in the case of the bolt based spells.

You still will not get a 'miss' like you do when attacking in melee where you do not even get a damage indicator.

Neither will a throw weapon.