Grimrock

Blackshark wrote:

Greco wrote:Mods and DLCs is a modern feature in gaming. But I am not sure it will work with old school games like Grimrock. Grimrock is not just hacking and slashing, it's after all puzzles. An I don't thing that fan based mods would add much to this. I would rather prefer a sequel, directly from the original development team. A trilogy would be ideal! And from what I remember every classic game (adventure or rpg) that had a sequel, this sequel superseded the first installment. (EOB, CSB, Baldur's Gate, Monkey Island, Day of the Tentacle), whenever the original team was involved in the sequel as well. So please, do not give the engine to the public please make a sequel!

What do other people think?

One word: MORROWIND.

Damn right.

http://youtu.be/2r6hilB6Dlc

Morrowind is one of the best games of all time, most notably because of its brilliant modding community that has put out stories and quests even better than the original game for a decade since it game out.

Can you IMAGINE what Grimrock would be like if the devs gave us not only a level editor, but the ability to import meshes/textures etc...? Within a year we'd have thousands of hours of content, at least twice the monsters, new traps... it would be bliss.

And NONE of that would take the original vanilla game away from the OP. So what exactly is the OP's problem with letting people make the game better for free?

regomar wrote:So what exactly is the OP's problem with letting people make the game better for free?

He must be a secret agent for EA. We all know how much EA hates user created content.

Loktofeit wrote:

Greco wrote:I don't doubt that there are there many people who can make interesting puzzles, but are these people willing to spend so much time? Perhaps you are right and I am wrong. Honestly, do you have any case of MOD/DLC for games other than puzzleless FPS and modern RPGs?

Here's two:

Wizardry 8 - Reforged
Neverwinter Nights - CEP Nexus


.

Do they involve any puzzles? I think they are both hasck and slash, quest based rpgs!

Kthanid wrote:I'm not sure I understand your objection to mods. You cite evidence such as your own lack of time to play, but I fail to see how that matters with regards to whether or not the community makes a bunch of games (or other lesser modifications) that you never use. What exactly is your concern with modding, maybe I'm missing the bigger picture (or maybe you're just trolling)?

I think i stated my reason clearly. I put it in first place and I state it again here: "the main reason I disagree with moding is that I fear that it would make the original team indifferent to making a sequel!"

seebs wrote:Frankly, I think you're insane. Modding does not prevent the devs from building maps, it creates an additional source of interest and thus funding. If you don't like player-made maps, you don't have to play them, but the fact is, the modern world is full of people who could make interesting puzzles. And I think the devs deserve a chance to play through a map or three of their lovely engine with puzzles that are new to them.

I agree. Modding has never hurt a game in any way and has always helped keep a game community alive for a longer time then those who didn't allow modding. DLC also does the same thing, and it isn't always needed to be bought, technically, this game as its currently distributed is DLC because DLC is Downloadable Content, it is not just extras, as it extends much further then that.

Greco wrote:I think i stated my reason clearly. I put it in first place and I state it again here: "the main reason I disagree with moding is that I fear that it would make the original team indifferent to making a sequel!"

Can you please explain precisely how you arrived at such a ludicrous conclusion? I'm truly trying hard to follow your logic, I'm just not able to connect the dots here. In what way does community involvement prevent a developer from pursuing their own sequels? Are there other games where you have seen this actually occur?

Pajamas wrote:

seebs wrote:Frankly, I think you're insane. Modding does not prevent the devs from building maps, it creates an additional source of interest and thus funding. If you don't like player-made maps, you don't have to play them, but the fact is, the modern world is full of people who could make interesting puzzles. And I think the devs deserve a chance to play through a map or three of their lovely engine with puzzles that are new to them.

I agree. Modding has never hurt a game in any way and has always helped keep a game community alive for a longer time then those who didn't allow modding. DLC also does the same thing, and it isn't always needed to be bought, technically, this game as its currently distributed is DLC because DLC is Downloadable Content, it is not just extras, as it extends much further then that.

First of all saying DLCs I meant community created content. Secondly, answeting the statement : "Modding has never hurt a game in any way", I would also say that never before was moding used on such type of game. Till now moding concerned RTS and Quest-based RPGs, none of which describe Grimrock.

Greco wrote:

Pajamas wrote:

seebs wrote:Frankly, I think you're insane. Modding does not prevent the devs from building maps, it creates an additional source of interest and thus funding. If you don't like player-made maps, you don't have to play them, but the fact is, the modern world is full of people who could make interesting puzzles. And I think the devs deserve a chance to play through a map or three of their lovely engine with puzzles that are new to them.

I agree. Modding has never hurt a game in any way and has always helped keep a game community alive for a longer time then those who didn't allow modding. DLC also does the same thing, and it isn't always needed to be bought, technically, this game as its currently distributed is DLC because DLC is Downloadable Content, it is not just extras, as it extends much further then that.

First of all saying DLCs I meant community created content. Secondly, answeting the statement : "Modding has never hurt a game in any way", I would also say that never before was moding used on such type of game. Till now moding concerned RTS and Quest-based RPGs, none of which describe Grimrock.

Grimrock without a modding community will never reach the potential that it would with a modding community. I also have a simple solution: do not download any mods and only play the official content.

In regards to your statement regarding the devs being indifferent: I again point you towards Morrowind. The construction set MADE Bethesda and, if I had to make an educated guess, drove up sales for Oblivion. Modding did the opposite of making devs indifferent.

Kthanid wrote:

Greco wrote:I think i stated my reason clearly. I put it in first place and I state it again here: "the main reason I disagree with moding is that I fear that it would make the original team indifferent to making a sequel!"

Can you please explain precisely how you arrived at such a ludicrous conclusion? I'm truly trying hard to follow your logic, I'm just not able to connect the dots here. In what way does community involvement prevent a developer from pursuing their own sequels? Are there other games where you have seen this actually occur?

None of course, but with a hell of content out there why a developer should bother creating a sequel. If i was a developer I would pursue something else. Too much content usually works the other way also. People get boredof the game and stop playing it, especially if the level of the content is not up to the level of the original. Not to mention that longing for a new game (sequel) fades away, when you have tons of mods to play. Guys, we don't speak here of FPS and quest based RPGs where you can pass your time killing, hacking and slashing. We speak of a game with specific characteristics, that needs wits. It is not Morrowind, it is not Oblivion, it is not Skyrim, these were games placed on a vast world environments and most of all quest-based. No puzzles at all. Tell me, please, a game with similar characteristics as Grimrock that 1) Allowed for modding 2) Benefited from them.

If you are saying that a puzzle game should not release their editor, play Portal.

Amnesia is a successful first person adventure horror game.
Their SDK also keep their fan base hard and strong.