Grimrock

Using a word in an unconventional way doesn't make you creative. Sure you could call the tall and fair creatures dwarfs and elves could be short and bearded but why confuse everyone? I would suggest the devs change the names of the stats in the future to something more appropriate because it seems a lot of people had to restart the campaign once this became clear. All in all not a bad EoB mod though, congrats.

We're possibly just being pedantic here... But dexterity and strength mean what the words mean in this game. It's just that decades of euphemism have made us form false impressions in our mind.

It used to be the case that dexterity equated to chance to hit, and strength equated to damage done. D&D broke that link and everything else seemed to follow D&D. Then it got more apparent when D&D allowed damage to be determined by dexterity, and strength was dropped altogether for damage calculations.

I don't think it's fair at all to expect LoG to follow D&D convention.

Dexterity does what it should do, and strength does what it should do.

I am of course sympathetic to people who have assumed that dex is a dump stat for rogues and str for fighters. But I'd rather have a balanced game where you choosing between two equally useful stats than have a game where fighters take str and rogues take dex.

I think we have all been made aware of your position on the subject. Regarding the ethymological background of STR and DEX in the gaming world I have no interest of tracing it back through 30+ years of role playing history. Today it is safe to say that DEX means ranged attack skill and STR correspondingly melee. For the devs it is useful to know that this has been a cause of irritation for many players. They may do what they like with that information.

Halk wrote:We're possibly just being pedantic here... But dexterity and strength mean what the words mean in this game. It's just that decades of euphemism have made us form false impressions in our mind.

It used to be the case that dexterity equated to chance to hit, and strength equated to damage done. D&D broke that link and everything else seemed to follow D&D. Then it got more apparent when D&D allowed damage to be determined by dexterity, and strength was dropped altogether for damage calculations.

I don't think it's fair at all to expect LoG to follow D&D convention.

Dexterity does what it should do, and strength does what it should do.

I am of course sympathetic to people who have assumed that dex is a dump stat for rogues and str for fighters. But I'd rather have a balanced game where you choosing between two equally useful stats than have a game where fighters take str and rogues take dex.

I disagree. You can kill a man by chopping his head off, which will require a good amount of strength to wield a weapon capable of doing such a task as well as being able to do it in one swing. You can also kill a man with an exacto knife in their neck severing a major artery. This doesn't require much strength, but does require a lot of dexterity. Knives in real life are more about how quick you are than how strong you are. A 90 year old grandmother could easily land a killing blow with a dagger. You think she could with a war hammer?

Saxi wrote:

Halk wrote:We're possibly just being pedantic here... But dexterity and strength mean what the words mean in this game. It's just that decades of euphemism have made us form false impressions in our mind.

It used to be the case that dexterity equated to chance to hit, and strength equated to damage done. D&D broke that link and everything else seemed to follow D&D. Then it got more apparent when D&D allowed damage to be determined by dexterity, and strength was dropped altogether for damage calculations.

I don't think it's fair at all to expect LoG to follow D&D convention.

Dexterity does what it should do, and strength does what it should do.

I am of course sympathetic to people who have assumed that dex is a dump stat for rogues and str for fighters. But I'd rather have a balanced game where you choosing between two equally useful stats than have a game where fighters take str and rogues take dex.

I disagree. You can kill a man by chopping his head off, which will require a good amount of strength to wield a weapon capable of doing such a task as well as being able to do it in one swing. You can also kill a man with an exacto knife in their neck severing a major artery. This doesn't require much strength, but does require a lot of dexterity. Knives in real life are more about how quick you are than how strong you are. A 90 year old grandmother could easily land a killing blow with a dagger. You think she could with a war hammer?

So... you're saying that upping your weapon's SKILL LEVEL until you earn CRITICAL HITS doesn't represent deftness and skill with a dagger?

Don't confuse dexterity with skill, people. Dexterity helps with accuracy, and the same is true of real life. But skill is more important than strength OR dexterity, and the same goes for real life. I'm a clumsy oaf that can't coordinate my left and right feet if my life depends on it, but I can still hit a target with a rifle or pistol almost effortlessly because I PRACTICED and became SKILLED.

This still reeks of you just wanting rogues to be one-stat-monsters.

Saxi wrote: I disagree. You can kill a man by chopping his head off, which will require a good amount of strength to wield a weapon capable of doing such a task as well as being able to do it in one swing. You can also kill a man with an exacto knife in their neck severing a major artery. This doesn't require much strength, but does require a lot of dexterity. Knives in real life are more about how quick you are than how strong you are. A 90 year old grandmother could easily land a killing blow with a dagger. You think she could with a war hammer?

Ok, how about we say instead that you're right about the difference between str and dex (I don't agree but it's not a big deal) and the game is wrong.

But why not let the game be wrong because it leads to a very pleasant conceit? It leads to everybody having to choose between str and dex for melee characters, and no one stat being best.

Isn't that a good game mechanic, and one worth suspending a touch of disbelief for?

Edit : Whoops, fixed quotes!

Rogues using DEX? What? Then you'd require a whole new set of stats for evasion and accuracy

What is the summary then?
Which attribute is responsible to max my Throwing and Missle damage outup?

Damage
Missle: ??
Throwing ??

This disscussion thread brought me no answer at all. Not as I expected. not tl'dr ;d

kkk wrote:What is the summary then?
Which attribute is responsible to max my Throwing and Missle damage outup?

Damage
Missle: ??
Throwing ??

This disscussion thread brought me no answer at all. Not as I expected. not tl'dr ;d

Is this a joke? You just resurrected an ancient thread to ask people to read for you?

Not only does the OP answer your question, but a developer was the 11th reply.

Jerk.