Grimrock

No comparisson, Skyrim is better... (casting genre-biased opinions aside).. Skyrim has higher production values, lots bigger in scope, way more things to do, more replay value, better graphics, better soundeffects, better story and better soundtrack

However Grimrock is quite good at what it does and what is it meant to be... ok it's not better then Eye of the beholder 1/2... but it's close, and that's quite the accomplishment.

DJK wrote:No comparisson, Skyrim is better... (casting genre-biased opinions aside).. Skyrim has higher production values, lots bigger in scope, way more things to do, more replay value, better graphics, better soundeffects, better story and better soundtrack

However Grimrock is quite good at what it does and what is it meant to be... ok it's not better then Eye of the beholder 1/2... but it's close, and that's quite the accomplishment.

You're right, they're very different games and they try to do very different things. Grimrock is very specific and is trying to bring you the ultimate dungeon.

One thing I've always been a bit disappointed by in the Elder Scrolls games is dungeon design and dungeon based puzzle elements (even though they do it a LOT better than Bioware!) and I think Grimrock's dungeon is more than a match for any one location in Skyrim. I can honestly say I enjoyed exploring and finding the dungeons in Skyrim, more than I did actually playing through them. Many of them, especially the fortresses, are more of a chore than anything else.

Grimrock's story is unashamedly an excuse for the existance of the setting, and not a lot else. However, I didn't find the main story in Skyrim particularly engaging either. A lot of the side-quests were better particularly the daedra quests. Grimrock's own sidestory, following Toorum's notes, may not be played out with spectacular locations, set-pieces and special effects but following it to its conclusion and freeing Toorum at least as enjoyable and rewarding as any of the quests in Skyrim. My perfect RPG probably has a setting/scale in an open world similar to the Elder scrolls but I would sacrifice a lot of the audio/visual production values for more DM/EoB like dungeon design.

I find Grimrock to be the better game. It's kind of the ultimate dungeon experience, like its predecessors. There's a ton of fun condensed into a relatively small space. In Skyrim I felt the fun was spread out over a larger game and thus didn't give as powerful an experience. Not that I don't like Skyrim. It was good. But I think Grimrock is great. I think it also proves that more money doesn't always translate into a better game.

DJK wrote:No comparisson, Skyrim is better... (casting genre-biased opinions aside).. Skyrim has higher production values, lots bigger in scope, way more things to do, more replay value, better graphics, better soundeffects, better story and better soundtrack

No comparison I agree. Skyrim is better in all aspects (replay value is questionable though; who will replay something which never finish?). It's more realistic I will add, it's bigger, etc. But it is not better as a game?
Because no matter the graphics, the sound, the quality what makes a good game is the challenging factor. And from this perspective, Grimrock is up to the sky, while Skyrim barely floats above the ground! You see, it is as always was, size does not matter. What is important is the satisfaction you get. And I am sure, that hard core gamers, are getting much more satisfaction solving puzzles and wandering through the dark corridors of the "small" Grimrock, than wandering around the plains and the mountains of the "huge" Skyrim!

I played Skyrim for a LONG time then got bored. I played Grimrock for a much shorter time and finished while still really enjoying it. Both great, but Skyrim is so big I don't really fancy replaying any time soon, where as I would love to jump right back into Grimrock once the fan made dungeons/any expansions arrive.

Plus Skyrim was inevitable where as LoG is a real blast from the past.

Daniel.

goundalf wrote:I don't really think you can compare the two. Skyrim has a higher character development path than LoG and a much more immersive world.
But LoG challenges you to best yourself and think harder then just killing some random people with your gloves of fire :).

You can compare different aspects they may have in common, there is no outdoor area in grimrock but plenty of dungeons and in skyrim too, also they're both rpgs, so I think it is too easy to say, you can't compare them eheh.
In my opinion grimrock was made with passion and even if it's small compared to skyrim, it really shines, and it's better than skyrim when you look at the dungeon crawling experience after all.
With skyrim I get the impression they wanted to do everything big just because they could say they've got a fantabulous number of dungeons and areas etc, while if you look closely everything is pretty average and repetitive.
So in the end grimrock is a better experience than skyrim if you're into dungeon crawling.

I'm sorry, but it has to be said, Skyrim is over-rated. It's graphics lushness dreams your RPG dreams for you, it's for graphics whores. There's little Role PLAYing and character consequence, but plenty of eye candy.

jontycampbell wrote:I'm sorry, but it has to be said, Skyrim is over-rated. It's graphics lushness dreams your RPG dreams for you, it's for graphics whores. There's little Role PLAYing and character consequence, but plenty of eye candy.

Indeed! ES3: Morrowind, and it's expansions (mainly bloodmoon) was the last good game in the Elder Scrolls series. Oblivion was so horrible and small with absolutely nothing to do, and Skyrim forced you to run back and forth and did everything to make you see every part of the map.

gasgas wrote:

goundalf wrote:I don't really think you can compare the two. Skyrim has a higher character development path than LoG and a much more immersive world.
But LoG challenges you to best yourself and think harder then just killing some random people with your gloves of fire .

You can compare different aspects they may have in common, there is no outdoor area in grimrock but plenty of dungeons and in skyrim too, also they're both rpgs, so I think it is too easy to say, you can't compare them eheh.
In my opinion grimrock was made with passion and even if it's small compared to skyrim, it really shines, and it's better than skyrim when you look at the dungeon crawling experience after all.
With skyrim I get the impression they wanted to do everything big just because they could say they've got a fantabulous number of dungeons and areas etc, while if you look closely everything is pretty average and repetitive.
So in the end grimrock is a better experience than skyrim if you're into dungeon crawling.

Very good post gasgas. I agree. I initially thought the dungeon crawling experience was fantastic in skyrim upon adventuring the first few in the game. I thought "Wow! This is like next gen DM!!" LOL. Then the repetitiveness of doing them kicked in after like 50th one. They all pretty much all feel the same, and it really makes you appreciate the claustrophobic feeling you get from the dungeon in LoG.

isamu wrote:

gasgas wrote:

goundalf wrote:I don't really think you can compare the two. Skyrim has a higher character development path than LoG and a much more immersive world.
But LoG challenges you to best yourself and think harder then just killing some random people with your gloves of fire .

You can compare different aspects they may have in common, there is no outdoor area in grimrock but plenty of dungeons and in skyrim too, also they're both rpgs, so I think it is too easy to say, you can't compare them eheh.
In my opinion grimrock was made with passion and even if it's small compared to skyrim, it really shines, and it's better than skyrim when you look at the dungeon crawling experience after all.
With skyrim I get the impression they wanted to do everything big just because they could say they've got a fantabulous number of dungeons and areas etc, while if you look closely everything is pretty average and repetitive.
So in the end grimrock is a better experience than skyrim if you're into dungeon crawling.

Very good post gasgas. I agree. I initially thought the dungeon crawling experience was fantastic in skyrim upon adventuring the first few in the game. I thought "Wow! This is like next gen DM!!" LOL. Then the repetitiveness of doing them kicked in after like 50th one. They all pretty much all feel the same, and it really makes you appreciate the claustrophobic feeling you get from the dungeon in LoG.

I think Elder Scrolls games will always suffer from that problem, there are some epic set-pieces but mostly the dungeons are uninteresting and unrewarding unless you really do enjoy picking up hoards of uninteresting artifacts so that you can sell them. Especially when you get to a certain level, the rewards become largely pointless and the enemies you find are all overpowered versions of the ones you were fighting at level 1. Skyrim also turns the skill system into something very linear, which is at odds with the non-linear nature of the gameworld.