My reviews of Grimrock 2 Custom Dungeons

[Spathi]

I would not get too upset at reviews. Have not played in Kahrak'arul yet, but nearly all the log2 mods have lacked so far, maybe it takes time, maybe log2 mods are almost too hard to get the balance right. Maybe because the full game is designed around the creatures, but many mods try to rearrange things and it does not work.

Log1 mods seemed much better, maybe because they are simpler to manage monsters or probably because I played them late last year after waiting. There were heaps of bad ones I suppose.

p.s. What I liked so far in log2 mods..
Things I found entertaining were sewers and forest rivers and water puzzles and pits. I find short mods are good (or ones I can quit on when it gets silly). Ones designed for low level characters with frogs and such.

Some of the problems with lots of mods...
Some have endless boss fights. I do not find "boss fights" that enticing, I would rather pick up sticks on a beach.
Many people seem to put in the grandiose creatures and lots of them, when it just don't need it. (The "if I can do it, you can" attitude. and "more is better" attitude)
Some have huge distances to walk for not much. Some have mazes worth of nothing.
Things that look like puzzles that are not... or puzzles that defy common sense.
Having no levels or weapons and having to fight insects or those wolf things straight off the bat.

[pstair]

This thread has turned into reviews of a review. Will eagerly await future reviews and the associated reviews of those reviews.

[leewroy]

Oh, my. Several days away of this thread and it turned to MMA, lol.

Let me grab the popcorn and get back, wait a minute.

But now, seriously. It must be hard to see people dissing your work, even in just ONE aspect. But that's the prize of fame, period.

And I agree that the grimrock 2 modules are YET poor (comparing to the amazing jobs on grimrock 1) that's why I stopped being the bitch that plays all of them

But I´m sure that soon we'll have great ones, and people don't actually need to get angry or whatever about modules and/or opinions about them.

Let's make modules, not war!

[Ixnatifual]

coreystinson clearly put a lot of time into both playing the mod and his detailed review. There's no need to bash him. I haven't played the mod myself, so I can't comment on how good or bad it is. Reviews of something like this are always personally biased, and what one person dislikes might appeal to another.

Maybe the author even learned something from the review that he could improve on for his next module. The review perhaps focused too much on the perceived weaknesses, but that's because it's always easier to point out flaws.

At any rate, I think any mod author deserves some credit for putting in time and soul into giving something to the community for free. But that doesn't make any of us immune to criticism. Criticism should be welcomed as it gives us opportunity to improve. Just take care not to simply "bash" as that might discourage authors from improving and putting out more of their work. I also think that if you point out something you perceive as a flaw, it can be really helpful to the author as well as other modders, how that aspect could be improved.

If you disagree with someone's review, I think a really good way to offer a counter point is to provide your own review of the work. Of course one can always "review the review"

[OGDA]

I thought I would drop a thread in here to review custom campaigns for Grimrock 2. Similar threads were helpful for me in picking out custom campaigns to play for the Grimrock 1 engine.

Now, on to the first review.

~ ~ ~

* The Legend of the Lost Dwarf Kingdom of Kahrak'arul

I suppose this might be the first finished, campaign length custom dungeon for Grimrock 2. As such, you can be guaranteed many hours of play time. This campaign features outdoor and indoor areas. You will have lengthy forays underground, especially as the campaign progresses. Campaign is extremely linear, often even within levels. Due to the lengthy dungeon forays you may find yourself for an extended period of time without access to items you may have dropped, so think carefully about what you choose to carry and what you choose to drop. I would talk about the back story for the campaign, but there really isn't much of one to this module. That is one of its weaknesses which I'll cover later. I took a party up to Level 12.

Strengths:

- Puzzles! The author clearly invested a lot of time working out some puzzles, challenging enough but none so unusually devious as to ruin the fun. This is the #1 strength of this campaign. Very nice work.

- Nice dungeon layouts, author has a solid grasp of the layout mechanics and dynamics of the game engine. You will feel as at home in them as you would in the original campaign. The Pyramid levels were exceptional and possibly even better than the Pyramid area in the original Grimrock 2 campaign.

- Large campaign, use of a variety of Grimrock 2 tilesets plus some from Grimrock 1 and one third-party tileset.

- Several well-done boss fights.

Weaknesses:

- Not a lot of healing crystals throughout the game. If you don't have an alchemist you will be in for a very tough slog.

- It seems to me that, even on the Normal difficulty setting, many of the monsters were more challenging to fight than in the original campaign. They also seemed to inflict more damage. I'm guessing the author in many cases increased monster hit points? I'm not sure if their damage abilities were increased as well, or if it was my lack of good armor throughout the campaign that resulted in my front row receiving more damage.

- Not a lot of items and armor - Given the size of this campaign, a better job could have been done providing the player with a variety of weapons, armor, and items to play with. Instead, my characters got quite powerful weapons about halfway through the campaign. They used these until the end. My characters were under-armored right up the end, and even then only one character was fully equipped with the best armor for his class. I suppose it is possible that i missed some secrets but I think not THAT many.

- There is one third-party tileset used here which was also used in some Grimrock 1 custom campaigns. It looks extremely crude and badly out of place when compared to the tilesets produce for the game by Almost Human. I get that this tileset is taken from or a throwback to some other older CRPG but, please, folks stop using this tileset. It's jarring!

- Lame background story - the background story for the campaign, such as it is, is underdeveloped and even what is there is poorly integrated into the campaign. There is at least one portion of the campaign (Test of the Initiate) that is a very lengthy dungeon crawl and seems to have nothing to do with the main campaign. It's almost as if this "side quest" was originally developed for Grimrock 1 then ultimately integrated into this Grimrock 2 module without much thought. Much about how the campaign progresses makes little sense, such as transitioning from the lowest level of the Catacombs (under the cemetery) out into some sewers, but what are these sewers underneath of? We never find out.

- Lack of serious approach - This somewhat relates to the backstory issue. The author was clearly not that concerned with a campaign that "plays is straight", embracing the fantasy cliches of this genre and suspending the player's disbelief. Instead, the game characters frequently banter in ways that suggest they're aware they are inside a CRPG. I get that this was an attempt at humor but it was highly annoying for me and takes away from the fantasy element. Occasionally it descends to the level of being juvenile. I definitely don't recommend this approach for other custom campaign creators. The ending is a massive disappointment.

SUMMARY: author has excellent grasp of game engine mechanics and has employed them to create a large puzzle and monster filled adventure. Dungeon layouts are always interesting. However, the back story for the campaign, as well as the player's interaction with this story, is poorly-handled. If you like your campaign drenched in atmosphere, mood, and storytelling then you will be disappointed here. For the record, Grimrock 1 and 2 original campaigns both fall a little short in this area, so we can only offer up so much criticism here.

Only one bug of note, the "Walk Every Tile" puzzle. Work-around in the author's thread for the module. I also noticed some odd behavior in the "Show me what you seek" puzzle, but it may have been somehow intentional.

Hello,

I won't go into detail for every point you listed, but I have to comment on some of them:

1. First, thank you for also pointing out positive aspects.

2. Not a lot of items and armor:
Nearly every armor-set in the campaign is complete, which means, that you missed quite some secrets and/or normal armor deposits.

3. There is one third-party tileset used...
You know, that is not just an opinion but an insult to several people who put hundreds of hours creating this well looking tileset. We only have a certain amount of tilesets available and it's completely normal, that you will see it in nearly every mod. They should be given respect for putting all that hard work into developing the models, textures and procedures of general tileset development.

4. Lame background story
I played a lot of Grimrock 1 mods and my personal opinion is, that Kahrak'arul contains a lot more background story than many others (which doesn't mean that less background story means less quality). The orginal campaign of Grimrock 2 has nearly no background story in comparison, so it's just a personal aspect.

5. Lack of serious approach
Well...

---------------------------------------------------

This mod was completely developed for Grimrock 2, no parts existed before or where planned for Grimrock 1.
Several hundreds of hours went into creating this mod and the same amount into playtesting by several people.

Kind regards,
Joerg

[Azel]

I haven't played this Mod but I'd love to see a screenshot of the tileset in question. Anyone have one they can post?

[cromcrom]

1. First, thank you for also pointing out positive aspects.

@ coreystinson, here is an example of basic courtesy skill. And humility. And generosity.

[minmay]

Christ man just let it go. Absolutely nobody here agrees with you that making a video game mod turns you into a flawless god beyond all criticism.

[MasterworkStone]

- Not a lot of healing crystals throughout the game. If you don't have an alchemist you will be in for a very tough slog.

It seems to be that you're not a very skilled player, as my only complaint is the extreme lack of food which brought my playthrough of it to a complete halt.
The lack of healing crystals doesn't bother me, I know how to tango with enemies, the only times I've used healing potions is whenever a character has an injury. And even then I still have a huge supply of herbs.

[Azel]

1. First, thank you for also pointing out positive aspects.

@ coreystinson, here is an example of basic courtesy skill. And humility. And generosity.

While that was a fair example of courtesy and humility, that literally was not an expression of generosity whatsoever. Although your incessant need to keep your imaginary Mod Crusade alive is a perfect example of desperation. But thanks for coming back to remind us how games with an Editor tend to empower the wrong type of person

It seems to be that you're not a very skilled player, as my only complaint is the extreme lack of food .

So while the author made it to the end of the Mod successfully given the current food variety, you think "he" is the one who isn't very skilled... as proven by the fact that you can't complete the game under the same conditions. Your argument is shaped like oatmeal.