Dematto wrote:I'm having trouble understanding...
why would food not be classified as one of those distraction/motivation factors? It's a subsystem that adds a layer of immersion and the illusion of urgency to the party's mission.
The latent conflict between the two systems--the conflict that you outline--helps drive the urgency by threatening to take away resting as a means to recovering health and energy.
It's part of their larger system of engagement, in line with what you mentioned. Rather than tap into awe and wonder, Grimrock tries to gently tweak the player's sense of fear and failure. That's why combat is real-time, right? So that you, as a player, are the real limitation and chances are you/I aren't always fast enough. We fumble spells. We miss attacks. We can't remember if there's a pit behind us. There was a secret button, but we don't know what it opened. And now I can't find my dart. And I don't know if Earth 3 Fire 2 does anything, but I sure hope it does. And oh god, that wasn't there before. The monsters are faster, they play by different rules. And now you're out of food and that means you have to use herbs to heal, and those take FOREVER to duplicate, and now you have a leg wound on two characters and one is overencumbered and you can't move, and you hear a scratching behind you. It's unfair. The deck is stacked.
Insert Batman Begins quote about falling.
First of all, thanks for giving an intellectual response gosh. I had to stop reading Dr. Disaster's posts to save IQ points. But I digress...
Food is definitely a distraction, but in my opinion it is the wrong type of distraction since it is distracting the player from the desire to solve the puzzle, as opposed to distracting the player from the frustration of trying to solve it. True adventure games distract from the frustration, not from the puzzle itself (and certainly don't add to it); which is why I could take a day to solve a single puzzle in Myst and love every minute of it. If the character in Myst needed to take a break to find food every hour then I certainly would not have committed to completing the epic 5-game masterpiece.
But I guess you are saying that having to go find food should distract from the frustration somehow (as opposed to adding to it). I am not sure how that would work; for example, when facing the UHU NA puzzle room after 20 minutes of getting it wrong I am not quite frustrated. Instead, I am intrigued. I am suddenly grabbing pen, paper, and a new batch of coffee... ready to write down test cases; now I'm in puzzle solving adventure heaven! But wtf, my characters are getting hungry so I either need to hurry up and solve the puzzle, leave the area to find food which kills the puzzle solving enjoyment, re-load my saved game to start over fresh, or waste a piece of food which only adds to the rushed feeling. I wasn't frustrated before, but the darn food is rushing me, so now I'm frustrated.
I very much disagree with the assertion that there is any sense of urgency that should be expected since very early on the "Island Master" leaves you a map of the entire region with a message that encourages you to pick any path and explore. You can try to head towards the Pyramid, the Ruins, or the Cemetary. The order does not matter, which completely contradicts any sense of urgency. So if there is no rush to complete any area in any certain order, then why is there is a rush to solve secrets, riddles, and puzzles?
Grimrock 2 is more about open world exploration that requires caution and patience; unlike the original Grimrock which is definitely a plot that requires urgent escape from a prison. Grimrock 2 is more like the original Myst: the player is trapped on an Island trying to unlock secrets... at your own pace.
With all that said, I do agree with everything you outlined: not fast enough, forgot about a trap, lost a dart, fumbled spells, broken limbs. Those are all great additions to the game that certainly "stack the deck against you." And we know that is how it should be because the notes from the Island Master make it very clear that you will fail and die no matter what choice you make. However, none of that leads to a sense of urgency; instead I feel it leads to a sense of caution and slow-paced advancement. The fact that your limbs can break means you have to "stop" and think before you jump down a shaft; or go find a rope so you can do so safely. Everything you mentioned supports caution and strategic planning; basically the opposite of urgency.
I was able to pharm exp in the Herder's Den for 3 days... definitely no sense of urgency there. Even combat is best accomplished by taking your time instead of rushing. To avoid broken limbs from battles, use Invisibility or the Forcefield to set up attacks. No, the only time I ever feel a sense of urgency is when I'm far from replenishing food sources and trying to solve a puzzle. I think the factors you outlined would all provide for a better experience if food was eliminated. For example, players would be more inclined to try to discover new Rune Spell combinations if they didn't have to worry about feeding the damn wizard
