[MOD]Toorum's Manor

Talk about creating Grimrock 1 levels and mods here. Warning: forum contains spoilers!
bongobeat
Posts: 1076
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 5:58 pm
Location: France

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by bongobeat »

rexornet wrote:Wow! Just finished this and I reckon it has been by far, the biggest and hardest mod I've ever played. In fact, I still don't know how I managed to complete it since many of the battles were just way WAY too hard for me. If I'm honest, some of them also became a really un-enjoyable grind to get through. Still, that's the way it was designed so it's fair enough I suppose. Just because it's a bit too hardcore for me doesn't make it wrong! :)

Having said that, I was still gripped enough by the story-line not to give up and I did enjoy searching for all the secrets and treasures. Some of the puzzles were a bit too convoluted (for me) and I would never have managed to get through them without the hints and discussion on this thread. IMHO a few extra clues about what to do, especially during the destruction of the factory, would have been a help.

In the end I played for 48 hours and found 115 secrets and 44 treasures.

I think I might have found another couple in the mines but I couldn't find a second blue gem for the door on level 10 and I was unable to open the door that needed the two enriched ores on level 22. For some reason I just couldn't get the adamantite forges to work. :(

Also failed to find the secret level 43. :evil:

Btw, Is it actually possible to find ALL the secrets? What I mean is that when I chose the "short" ending, finding Toorum's Sanctuary came up as a secret for level 25 but when I did the "long" ending it came up as a secret for level 54. Presumably you can't have both in the same game?

Hated the Warden Prison level but that's more to do with the fact that the cube always freaks me out! It has done so ever since the original game. The actual puzzle was cleverly designed but really REALLY tough. It felt like there was no margin for error and it took me ages to get through it... I'm even MORE traumatized by the cube now! :lol:

It does make me wonder though if this and some of the other timed puzzles (such as the white blobs firing at receptors) might become impossible to do if you're playing on a machine that has even the slightest bit lag? Fortunately I only tended to experience lag issues when there were lots of monsters on screen; mainly the neverending Shrak Torr on level 9 and anywhere that had a tons of archers.

The Supermachine level was completely bonkers!!! :shock: Thank god I kept most of the guns to use on the Red Warden Boss. I'd have probably still been fighting him yet if I was just relying on swords and arrows! That was a crazy battle.

As someone who doesn't know how to operate the console (so no spawning items or teleporting past locked doors for me! :oops: ), I'm always in awe of those who make mods for the community. This one has obviously taken a lot of time and effort to put together, so many thanks to Bongobeat even though you have put my stress levels through the roof!

I'm away for a lie down now! :mrgreen:
Hello, I'm glad you have finished and liked it! :D
that's true, it is very difficult.
About the factory destruction, I'm still did not know what I can do more to help the player. I have increased the timer before destruction, so that gives more time to escape. Maybe I should increase the timer more? what do you think? Or if you have any idea you are welcome.
I'm adding wall text to show the way.

I'm like you, I have difficult for some battle in the mod, (that's why it's better to start the mode in easy difficulty), and something can help you greatly, the freeze monster spell, it does miracle!

If you think about clues of anything, please tell me in pm or in this thread. I'm actually re-playing my mod and make a correction in the same time. I define the white blobs, only locking some secrets, but no more needed to continue the game.

True, if you choose the shortest way, you can't find all treasures and secrets. I can't manage that, as you can have 2 ways, it was only done to reduce game playing time.

Honnestly I did not like the warden prison too (because of the cube), I've already increased timers for the final room in the prison, what do you think can make it more optimized?

I have not a high configuration computer and play in 1600, with rendering high and texture high, other options are set to low, personally I got lag when theareonan mage launch their spells, I suppose it lags because sometimes they're are four, and they launch four spells in same time, do you have experienced any lag with them?
Most of the players tells me about a lag in level 9, I have actually removed more monsters in the next version of the mod.

anyway it's up to the player to reduce graphic quality, if it is not a recent computer. All setting in low except rendering can help greatly, with a resolution lower that 1920*1080

console tips:
to teleport the party:
party:setPosition(x,y,facing,level)

to heal the party:
party:heal()

to spawn something:
spawn("item_name")

for a torch:
spawn("torch")

you can access the level43, only by the level 13, it is near the stairs for level 14 (after you have choosing the long way, and pass the "mirror" room)

to enrich the adamantite in level 22, press the button of the forge first (better, or sometimes it can crash, don't know why), then place the raw adamantite, don't try the big adamantite ore, it will not work. And don't put 2 items on the forge it will not work.
they are 2 adamantites rock in the level, one is in a secret, the other is in the end, in the "teleports" room. Normally you should have this one.

in the mine level (underground lvl 10):
one blue gem is located in the north: you have to pass a pit puzzle
the other blue gem is in the south, only accessible by level 9. I suppose you have found the door with the daemon head. There is another gate, that gives you access to the rest of the level 10 and 2 levers.
1 lever open the gate, the other lever open the gate of the "storage room", it is nearby, (south west of lvl 10), the gem is inside the room.
My asset pack: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=9320

Log1 mod : Toorum Manor: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5505
User avatar
rexornet
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2013 2:19 am

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by rexornet »

Thanks for the clues about the secrets I missed. I was able to go back and complete the blue gems room and also find level 43. I'm kicking myself for not discovering that by myself as I remember thinking something was strange with that wall when I first saw it due to the metal slate near the bottom. Can't believe I never thought to strike it to get rid of the blockage on the other side. :oops:

Still couldn't solve the forge puzzle as I can't find the small adamantite rocks. I've scoured the whole level and tried using every rock I found in the forge, but to no avail. I suspect I've already picked up those rocks and without realising they were special, just used them elsewhere in the game. Oh well, c'est la vie.

About the factory destruction - I don't think the timers need to be increased as there IS enough time to escape once you work out where you need to go. I think the problem I had was that it didn't always feel clear to me what I needed to do in the factory and spaceship areas so I ended up wandering around a bit aimlessly for a time not quite knowing what to do next to make progress. I'm not sure if that was just me being a bit dense, but I didn't have that problem in the earlier part of the game. Maybe a few more wall texts or scrolls giving salient clues would help?

In the Warden Prison, the worst part for me was the little corridor with the portcullis doors that needed to be opened rather than the big room at the end with the blob puzzle, so again, I don't think the timers need changing in the final room but maybe a fraction more time could be given for the corridor where the cube is constantly less than a tenth of a second away from squishing you.

Yes, the freeze monster spell was a great help and I wouldn't have survived any of the big battles without it. However, it didn't always work, especially on the archers where it only seemed to freeze them around 70% of the time. I wasn't sure why that was, unless you deliberately made some of the archers immune to cold spells?

I did get an occasional lag with the Theareonan Mages but nothing too bad; unlike the Shrak Torr on level 9 which did become a bit irritating at times. There's quite a lot to do on that level so you can't really escape the annoying slow-down. I'm glad you're removing some of the Shrak Torr as that will hopefully make it flow better. Maybe you could also replace some with Beholders too, that way you're not having to compromise too much on the challenge factor in the level.

Thank you for the tips on using the console. One of the reasons I've avoided trying to learn how to use it in the past is because I think I'd become too tempted to just start cheating my way through a game. However, I did give it a go after reading your reply and managed to spawn a few items though I still wasn't able to teleport beyond a door I was standing in front of (don't think I was getting the x,y, bit right as it kept telling me the paramators were wrong!) :roll: I really am a technical dumbo! :lol: I also tried (and failed) to spawn an orange cube which made me realise that unless you know the exact name of a custom item, the spawn doesn't really help either... anyway, enough of that! I don't want to start hijacking the thread away from your mod - or give everyone else more cause to laugh at my console stupidity. :oops: :P
bongobeat
Posts: 1076
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 5:58 pm
Location: France

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by bongobeat »

SpoilerShow
rexornet wrote:Thanks for the clues about the secrets I missed. I was able to go back and complete the blue gems room and also find level 43. I'm kicking myself for not discovering that by myself as I remember thinking something was strange with that wall when I first saw it due to the metal slate near the bottom. Can't believe I never thought to strike it to get rid of the blockage on the other side. :oops:

Still couldn't solve the forge puzzle as I can't find the small adamantite rocks. I've scoured the whole level and tried using every rock I found in the forge, but to no avail. I suspect I've already picked up those rocks and without realising they were special, just used them elsewhere in the game. Oh well, c'est la vie.

About the factory destruction - I don't think the timers need to be increased as there IS enough time to escape once you work out where you need to go. I think the problem I had was that it didn't always feel clear to me what I needed to do in the factory and spaceship areas so I ended up wandering around a bit aimlessly for a time not quite knowing what to do next to make progress. I'm not sure if that was just me being a bit dense, but I didn't have that problem in the earlier part of the game. Maybe a few more wall texts or scrolls giving salient clues would help?

In the Warden Prison, the worst part for me was the little corridor with the portcullis doors that needed to be opened rather than the big room at the end with the blob puzzle, so again, I don't think the timers need changing in the final room but maybe a fraction more time could be given for the corridor where the cube is constantly less than a tenth of a second away from squishing you.

Yes, the freeze monster spell was a great help and I wouldn't have survived any of the big battles without it. However, it didn't always work, especially on the archers where it only seemed to freeze them around 70% of the time. I wasn't sure why that was, unless you deliberately made some of the archers immune to cold spells?

I did get an occasional lag with the Theareonan Mages but nothing too bad; unlike the Shrak Torr on level 9 which did become a bit irritating at times. There's quite a lot to do on that level so you can't really escape the annoying slow-down. I'm glad you're removing some of the Shrak Torr as that will hopefully make it flow better. Maybe you could also replace some with Beholders too, that way you're not having to compromise too much on the challenge factor in the level.

Thank you for the tips on using the console. One of the reasons I've avoided trying to learn how to use it in the past is because I think I'd become too tempted to just start cheating my way through a game. However, I did give it a go after reading your reply and managed to spawn a few items though I still wasn't able to teleport beyond a door I was standing in front of (don't think I was getting the x,y, bit right as it kept telling me the paramators were wrong!) :roll: I really am a technical dumbo! :lol: I also tried (and failed) to spawn an orange cube which made me realise that unless you know the exact name of a custom item, the spawn doesn't really help either... anyway, enough of that! I don't want to start hijacking the thread away from your mod - or give everyone else more cause to laugh at my console stupidity. :oops: :P
Ok, version 1.43 is up, on dropbox
nexus coming tomorrow

well for the forge puzzle, the 2 adamantite rock are in the same level (1 hidden in a secret, easy to find, the other is in one of the teleports rooms, after you get a key, in the large room, with some kind of black and white chess floor)
when I talk about forge level, it's the level with the mine, and the tons of big adamantite rocks on the floor, level 22.
but I don't mean the forge section, in the 1st level of the factory (lvl 20).

About the lag, I removed 1 monster, there is actually 9 x 2 shrak respawn, espaced with a 20 sec timer. This is not lot of monsters. I finally splitter the respawn into So there is a first spawn of 5 monsters, and when you go near the end of the big caves it respawn 5 times in more. So all monsters will not be in the same time, as the first timed spawns should have been killed. (I'm not sure of what I wrote, cause it is hard to translate french into english).

Well not sure if it will be better with beholder, they're are more dangerous, as they can shoot very fast. by the way I have increase a little the cool down of the attack delay of all beholders.

In the factory, I have added 5 notes, that explains better the whole area. And what to do, or search. Signed maximo.

For the warden prison I haven't changing timer yet, I will do something in the next version (V1.44), honestly, I forgot what you say about this section :oops: .

The human archer are immune to cold, so normally they should not freeze, if they do, that is a bug, same for the shooting wardens (immune to cold), it will become too easy then. ;)
About immune, I noticed that some dragons have a wrong immunity, I ve modified that.

well, for the position, you should try some numbers, you can not have the exact position in the game, or if it possible I don't know how to do.
(the positions numbers: x is a horizontal position, the y is the vertical. It's like coordinates in a 2d plan)
on the editor map:
the 0 (in x) start in the top corner left, of the map(grid) then the 1, 2, ect…

the 0 (in y) start in the top of the map (or grid).

the total length of the "grid" is 32, starting at 0 and ending at 31, don't try to put more, or the game can crash, same for the level number, if it don't exist, the game crash.

anyway, the real map that you see in the game, may not start on x(0) or y(0), it depends of the design, the first room or anything else, can start a 8(x) and 7(y), that's why you need to try any numbers. Then, you can count the "squares" with your map, to be more precise for your next moves, by adding or removing numbers.
SpoilerShow
the editor map:

start<<0-------x----1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12-13-ect-----31>>end
^
0
.
.
.
y
.
.
1
2
3
4
5
.
.
31
end
example to teleport:
party:setPosition(10,15,1,8)

you will teleport the party in the level 8, at coordinate x 10, coordinate y 15, and facing east (1) (facing means that you will see in the east)
so I don't know why you do something wrong, but maybe you have inversed the x and y?

hermm, yes… if you don't know the exact name of the items, you will have problem to spawn them ;)
the item name that you saw in the description, is not the same for all items. Like the greaves of valor, the exact id name is greaves_valor.
But maybe is it possible to have a list of all items used in the dungeon, with a command in the console.
My asset pack: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=9320

Log1 mod : Toorum Manor: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5505
bongobeat
Posts: 1076
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 5:58 pm
Location: France

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by bongobeat »

A new version is up (V1.44)

while playing it I noticed a bug that make the player stuck forever.
I will not have time to upload the mod on nexus, so I only put it in dropbox.

please use this download link or the link in the first page of this thread

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fits072qsrawy ... rV1.44.zip
My asset pack: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=9320

Log1 mod : Toorum Manor: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5505
User avatar
rexornet
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2013 2:19 am

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by rexornet »

Hi Bongobeat, sorry for the late reply.

Thanks again for the extra tips on working the console. I think I follow what you mean about teleporting the party but I haven't tried it out yet.

I'm glad you've entered the new Maximo notes in the factory areas. That was the only part of the mod that didn't seem to be very clear to me. I personally don't need them now, of course, since I know what to do in the factory :lol: but I'm sure they will still help to clarify the storyline and give it a more 'fleshed out' atmosphere the next time I play.

You have made me doubt myself about the freeze spell working on the Archers. I did think it had worked on them some of the time but it is now hard to remember as most of those battles were just so crazy and I was firing off spells as quickly as possible all over the place that maybe I was actually freezing other monsters such as the goromorgs and getting myself mixed up as to who it was working on? :oops:

The Warden prison was, without a doubt, the most horrible part of the mod for me and was VERY hard and frustrating to get through. I obviously managed to do it in the end but it wasn't an enjoyable experience at all, and if I'm honest, it's the thought of having to attempt it again that is almost putting me off wanting to replay any time soon. Any help with the timers would be a help! That bloody cube just traumatizes the hell out of me!!! :shock:

I will download the new version to play again some time in the future, but it wont be for a while yet. TM was so massive and arduous to get through the first time that I think I'm better off giving myself a long break before I make a second attempt. I definitely want to see if I can discover the rest of the secrets and treasures I didn't find.
User avatar
AnnElfwind
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 3:26 pm
Contact:

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by AnnElfwind »

I've got a problem... Need help if anyone's willing.
SpoilerShow
It is a matter of wizard. It is white and it can be found in the forest.

What does that mean and where do I find it? And please, tell me I don't have to go all the way back up in order to get snow...
Thanks in advance.
bongobeat
Posts: 1076
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 5:58 pm
Location: France

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by bongobeat »

Hello,
try the whitewood wand
there is one, somewhere in the beginning, and another one in the level 2 entrance.
My asset pack: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=9320

Log1 mod : Toorum Manor: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5505
User avatar
AnnElfwind
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 3:26 pm
Contact:

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by AnnElfwind »

bongobeat wrote:Hello,
try the whitewood wand
there is one, somewhere in the beginning, and another one in the level 2 entrance.
Thank you. Hopefully, I won't have to go look for it because I left it somwhere. :)
User avatar
AnnElfwind
Posts: 180
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 3:26 pm
Contact:

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by AnnElfwind »

Two more things, if someone is willing to help.
SpoilerShow
Blue as sky - is it the blue gem? If not, what is it.
Give me light - Is it a torch or a lightning rod? Or the scroll of light I dropped somwhere because I didn't have enough room in my inventory...
Thanks in advance. :)
bongobeat
Posts: 1076
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 5:58 pm
Location: France

Re: [MOD]Toorum's Manor

Post by bongobeat »

AnnElfwind wrote:Two more things, if someone is willing to help.
SpoilerShow
Blue as sky - is it the blue gem? If not, what is it.
Give me light - Is it a torch or a lightning rod? Or the scroll of light I dropped somwhere because I didn't have enough room in my inventory...
Thanks in advance. :)
blue as … is the blue gem
light is a torch
My asset pack: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=9320

Log1 mod : Toorum Manor: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5505
Post Reply